Too many bullies

[DeletedUser110131]

Hate to tell you this, but I never needed to fact check. My memory works just fine.

Wow! So, you remembered when I started playing, off the top of your head, no need to look me up? Amazing! You just keep flattering me! It doesn't go so well with your claim not to take an interest in my personal gaming history, though.

I remember another description that says "city building strategy game".

There may have been some marketing with the potential to mislead some. It still says "strategy", though, and they never conceal the fact that it's multiplayer, so I'll still contend that the competitive aspect, where good decisions are rewarded and bad decisions punished, shouldn't be a surprise to anyone.

 

[DeletedUser110131]

@Agent327 , @Chalinna , @Quintense : I logged on just in time to read your replies. As they were deleted, I realize that the mod finally got enough of me and Agent327. Probably sensibly so. In fact, thanks to the mod for the demonstrated patience and received leniency! I've self-censored away my reply to our off-topic topic. The one thing I'll keep in is this: The absence of smileys and LOLs in my posts shouldn't be mistaken for a bad mood. For me, it's all in good fun. I'm sure Agent327 can handle it, as well.

On with the on-topic topic:

The real bullies in this game are the ones that flip out after they get plundered. They send nasty letters to the plunderer and when they get put on ignore, they resort to bullying them in their profile. True babies!

That's a very good point. Plundering is a part of the game. When someone plunders, and someone else is plundered, that's intended content of the game. It's a reward and a challenge that is supposed to be there. There's nothing rude or immoral about it. Nasty letters that don't fall under role play, however, are not part of the game. They're certainly rude, and, in some cases, immoral.

For those who are confused about the distinction between role play and bullying, here are two examples, very close to some that I've actually received:

This one is a legitimate part of the game, and perfectly fine: "You scoundrel! I must demand that you seize and desist in your banditry, and leave the good people of my city in peace! If you continue, I shall have to order the priests in the Temple of Relics to place a curse upon your head, that you never again win a relic in the GE!"

However, this one is not a legitimate part of the game, and not fine: "What kind of pathetic creep would use a game to steal from others? You have no morals, and I'm sure you're also a thief in real life. No good and honest person could behave like you. You're a sociopath. You have no empathy, and I hope you go to prison, because you're probably violent to people around you."

I'm sure there are those who have received much worse than I have.

 

[1911Luvr]

Plundering is obviously a part of the game that the developers wanted to include. But it is frustrating for people to have no defense other than "Collect on time". It could be made more fair for the defender and more challenging to the attacker. As it stands, defensive armies are basically worthless. Which is why people don't even bother and keep the 2 spearmen. What is the ratio of the defensive army being defeated(and getting plundered) to successfully fending off an attack?

 

[Amy Steele]

@Agent327 , @Chalinna , @Quintense : I logged on just in time to read your replies. As they were deleted...

Several posts were indeed deleted, for being off topic. Such 'asides' are best kept for private conversations, as they are bound to be off topic or otherwise against our rules in any thread on this forum. Please bear in mind though that our forum rules apply also to private conversations.

Let's stick to the topic from this point forward please

 

[DeletedUser110131]

Plundering is obviously a part of the game that the developers wanted to include. But it is frustrating for people to have no defense other than "Collect on time". It could be made more fair for the defender and more challenging to the attacker. As it stands, defensive armies are basically worthless. Which is why people don't even bother and keep the 2 spearmen. What is the ratio of the defensive army being defeated(and getting plundered) to successfully fending off an attack?

There are more things that can be done. I've given some advice on it, as have others.

The average ratio of successful defence is pretty bad, I suspect. I've overcome defense boosts more than triple my own offense boost (that cost me most of the attacking troops, though). The purpose isn't to fend off all attacks, but to make the attacker pay. The highest price that can be inflicted on the attacker is time. If the defence is good enough that the attacker must fight manually or loose, then either the defence will become successful (as the attack is auto battle), or the attacks will become rarer. Not many have the time for 75 manual fights per day...

 

[Dead-Eye]

I'm sure there are those who have received much worse than I have.

Yes and its awesome.

 

[DESYPETE]

its easy to stop players from sitting in low ages, just make all the gbs only available once they reach a certain age, so there is no way anyone can get a traz till you hit moden age wtc it will soon stop them trading fps for high age goods to get hold of the latest gb, if they want them then they have to advance, and also change the game so there are no higher age troops given out as rewards in quests those 2 changes would change the game with ease.

 

[DeletedUser110131]

its easy to stop players from sitting in low ages, just make all the gbs only available once they reach a certain age, so there is no way anyone can get a traz till you hit moden age wtc it will soon stop them trading fps for high age goods to get hold of the latest gb, if they want them then they have to advance, and also change the game so there are no higher age troops given out as rewards in quests those 2 changes would change the game with ease.

You're right, that would make it harder for guilds to find people willing to farm for low age goods. Since guild goods from GBs like Arc and Atomium would become unavailable, though, all those who do farm will have no choice other than to plunder. With all their FPs going into Zeus, against players without even theoretical access to defensive GBs... Wow, that'll be ugly. Meanwhile:
- Low age players will be even more outgunned and outclassed in GvG; contributing in any way on the Iron Age map will be impossible for anyone below Progressive Era.
- Everyone will be locked into a set trajectory, getting the same GBs, in the same way, at the same time, in the same sequence. Strategy and variation will be streamlined into linear monotony. Creativity will be lost, replaced by paint-by-numbers.
- One of the very best quest rewards in the game will be removed, and the motivation for those quests gone.
- GE level IV will become completely un-fightable.
- Several things I'm sure I'll think of after I hit "Post Reply".

On the other hand, those with no interest or talent for strategy gaming will thrive for the week or two it takes them to get bored and leave the game.

Seems like a fair trade off...?

 

[DeletedUser114342]

What is the ratio of the defensive army being defeated(and getting plundered) to successfully fending off an attack?

I don’t know what the ratio of DA being defeated, but I do know that my DA defeats most attackers if they even bother after seeing what they are facing.

If the attacker continues their attack after seeing my DA, they then fall under my radar and even though they are unsuccessful, I retaliate and plunder them. This includes people who have more status points than I do, sometimes 3x more. It does not mean their defense is any good.

 

[DeletedUser114342]

its easy to stop players from sitting in low ages, just make all the gbs only available once they reach a certain age, so there is no way anyone can get a traz till you hit moden age wtc it will soon stop them trading fps for high age goods to get hold of the latest gb, if they want them then they have to advance, and also change the game so there are no higher age troops given out as rewards in quests those 2 changes would change the game with ease.

There are many reasons why people like to camp in any ages. The thing is, what is available for one is available for all. So you too can get advanced aged GBs if you really wanted to. Why try to fix something that ain’t broke?

Being plundered is not the worse thing and this assumption that long term campers are all plundering newbies is laughable. Most times if my city gets attacked, it’s by someone who ranks in the middle or someone who is lower ranked than me.

 

[Emberguard]

Biggest problem with asking for GBs available to be limited to current age and below is anyone starting the game would then be at a massive disadvantage to everyone else before them

That aside the DAs are limited in how they can help the defender beyond defence/attack boosts due to all the resources a established player already has at disposal compared to a new player.

So you're stuck with the problem of how do you help the defender without making an impossible situation for newer players?

One possibility would be give defenders a second wave to work with. Even if it's only half of a full army for the second wave it'd at least improve it in a meaningful manner. The only thing of course is it'd give established players a defence that's even harder for new players to breach and the new players would still have to work out what a defensive army is for it to benefit them

 

[Agent327]

There are many reasons why people like to camp in any ages. The thing is, what is available for one is available for all. So you too can get advanced aged GBs if you really wanted to. Why try to fix something that ain’t broke?

True, everybody can get advanced GB's, but will you when you start playing the game as a new player? Let's say you start out and play with a normal pace. Find yourself a nice guild and really enjoy the way you move on in the game. In about two to three months you will hit EMA and get into a hood with someone that has been camping there for 3 years. Are you supposed to get those advanced GB's as well at that time, knowing you can never catch up anyhow< or do you quit knowing you play a game you will never accomplish anything in? I bet some will go for that last option.

 

[DeletedUser114342]

True, everybody can get advanced GB's, but will you when you start playing the game as a new player? Let's say you start out and play with a normal pace. Find yourself a nice guild and really enjoy the way you move on in the game. In about two to three months you will hit EMA and get into a hood with someone that has been camping there for 3 years. Are you supposed to get those advanced GB's as well at that time, knowing you can never catch up anyhow< or do you quit knowing you play a game you will never accomplish anything in? I bet some will go for that last option.

I don’t know bout everyone else, but I did. I’ve only been playing since July 2018, and I have already surpassed many players who have been playing longer than me. It did take time and effort and a lot of strategy to make it happen. I did my research, looked through the forums (not just this one, wiki and asked for advice from guildirs and people from this forum).

For me, the reason why I got the advanced GBs was not to try and catch up with people who had been playing much longer than me as the status points was not a factor at all in my decision making, but I wanted the more advanced GBs coz I thought they would make my FOE experience easier.

I have not regretted this decision and on the plus side, I tend to be in the top 10 of each hood.

 

[DeletedUser110131]

One possibility would be give defenders a second wave to work with. Even if it's only half of a full army for the second wave it'd at least improve it in a meaningful manner. The only thing of course is it'd give established players a defence that's even harder for new players to breach and the new players would still have to work out what a defensive army is for it to benefit them

One thing is that the first wave might deplete the attacking army. As important is that the attacker will have to spend time to fight twice, and have to win both fights to be able to plunder. The first point will increase the advantage of offensive GBs, which will improve the chances of having a surviving army for the second battle. However, the two latter points are largely independent of GBs; they won't significantly increase the disadvantage of new players. So how about two distinct battles being necessary before looting? The attacker is allowed to replenish his/her army, but does have to put in twice the time, and win twice. This should still leave new players with a chance at successful retaliation, as well as doing some plundering of their own.

In about two to three months you will hit EMA and get into a hood with someone that has been camping there for 3 years. Are you supposed to get those advanced GB's as well at that time, knowing you can never catch up anyhow< or do you quit knowing you play a game you will never accomplish anything in? I bet some will go for that last option.

1. The likelihood of encountering a three year camper who also takes an interest in extensive plundering is very low.
2. You'll only be in this campers neighbourhood intermittently, and mostly for only two weeks at a time.
3. One looting per day is perfectly possible to overcome. Yes, it does increase the difficulty level slightly, but it most certainly doesn't mean you can't accomplish anything in the game.
4. There are plenty of things you can do that won't require catching up to the camper. Some are described elsewhere in this topic, and on the forum, by me and by others.
   
5. If the problem really is a three year camper, it's incredibly unlikely that he/she will follow you when you move to the next age. In other words, it's a temporary problem. So, stay calm, and carry on. When you're ready for it, move up, and you'll be rid of the camper. (Of course, if the "camper" follows you, then you were wrong: It's not a camper, just someone who plays the game incredibly much better than you. In this case it's clear that you suck at strategic thinking, and really need the practice this challenge provides. If you won't meet the challenge, but insist on continuing to believe that the game is unfair to you, it's better for everyone if you make a break for it before your self esteem suffers permanent damage. I'm sure even Inno will be willing to forego some profit, in order not to cripple you for life.)
6. You really can catch up. That's what the camper did to those before her/him. He/she is living proof that it's possible. Even the campers were once n00bs, you know. You don't have to "catch up", though; see points 1 through 5.

All experienced players are aware of this and more, and most will gladly share their knowledge with guild-mates, friends, neighbors, random strangers, and on the forum.

 

[Agent327]

I don’t know bout everyone else, but I did. I’ve only been playing since July 2018, and I have already surpassed many players who have been playing longer than me. It did take time and effort and a lot of strategy to make it happen. I did my research, looked through the forums (not just this one, wiki and asked for advice from guildirs and people from this forum).

That rather makes you the exception and not the rule. Players like you will not get discouraged by some setback. It are the casual players that are most likely to throw in the towel. Purpose of this game isn't to reach EMA, or any other age except VF for now and stay there forever. If it was there wouldn't be new ages.

 

[DeletedUser110131]

That rather makes you the exception and not the rule. Players like you will not get discouraged by some setback. It are the casual players that are most likely to throw in the towel. Purpose of this game isn't to reach EMA, or any other age except VF for now and stay there forever. If it was there wouldn't be new ages.

That fact that something is there, doesn't make it the sole purpose of the game. Let's try the argument on something else: "The purpose of this game isn't to advance through the ages. If it was, there wouldn't be any plunder functionality".

Wow, did I just prove that plundering is the only real purpose of the game? I always thought of the game as a complex of opportunities to be explored, and that exploration as the purpose. In other words, if I decided that the complex of this game was the perfect setting for building a pretty city, and I wanted a pretty city, then that would be one of the purposes of the game. If I considered putting all my FPs into the tech-tree to be the height of joy on Earth, then that would be one of the purposes. If someone decided that winning the PvP tournaments was a major source of satisfaction, then that would be one of the purposes of the game. I thought that all of these purposes were legitimate, and that there was no good reason for begrudging others the purposes that they find in the game.

As it turns out, I've been wrong all this time! There is plundering, therefore plundering is the sole purpose of the game!

Right! I'd better get out there and crush some n00bs, then!

 

[TheKingOfKool]

If you really don't want to get plundered, why bother to play the game at all. You are going to get disappointed - and - it's going to happen all the time if you make a big deal out of it. I get plundered all the time too. I don't give a dam though. I don't get angry or mad. I do get even if possible. Sometimes it take me a year to catch the plunderer - then its no mercy. Come thru my hood in any of my worlds and you can do aid or get attacked if attacked if I'm in the mood.

Make yourself known by continually attacking and retreating and that's a plunder just for being annoying. If you do breach my defense - have fun - take something - It won't scar me for life - I can assure you - lol.

Expect it!

 

[Agent327]

If you really don't want to get plundered, why bother to play the game at all. You are going to get disappointed - and - it's going to happen all the time if you make a big deal out of it. I get plundered all the time too. I don't give a dam though. I don't get angry or mad. I do get even if possible. Sometimes it take me a year to catch the plunderer - then its no mercy. Come thru my hood in any of my worlds and you can do aid or get attacked if attacked if I'm in the mood.

Make yourself known by continually attacking and retreating and that's a plunder just for being annoying. If you do breach my defense - have fun - take something - It won't scar me for life - I can assure you - lol.

Expect it!

You put the focus on plundering, but that is not what the topic is about, so let me repeat that for you.

There is a growing number of expert players camping in the Iron age and EMA preying on new players, stealing their stuff. The problem is growing, and if not addressed it could eventually wreck this game.

You need to find a way to keep the bullies away from new players.

 

[DeletedUser110131]

You put the focus on plundering, but that is not what the topic is about, so let me repeat that for you.

You're full of surprises, 327! Now you don't believe that he's referring to plundering, when he writes "preying on new players, stealing their stuff"?

The topic is a "problem", and "preying" and "stealing" is the problem description. To assume that he means that the existence of "expert players" is the problem is absurd. The "expert players" vs. "new players" is simply a theory as to the cause of "the problem". Also worth noting is that it's pure conjecture when we assume that these "expert players" he's referring to are campers. They may simply be very skilled with the battle system; anyone who can plunder every n00b in the neighbourhood every day, that is, both win all the battles AND successfully find something worth plundering in every city, can reasonably be described as "expert", even if he/she is a new player her-/himself. This is, by the way, perfectly possible to do, as a n00b, with a young city.

 

[DeletedUser100133]

Hello,

As you can see a few more comments has been edited or deleted due to them breaching the rules, please read the rules and stick to the topic.

Thank you