GB balancing changes - discussion thread

[Praeceptor]

3% attack on defense is more than 0% attack on defense
so 3% more in half and 1% less in the other is still 2% more for DGB

Lol - I agree - if you include attack there is a slight advantage to the GB. However the GB currently has 10% def which means def drops by 70% of its original value.

A guy in my hood has 27 towers - thats 108% def bonus. His GBs will drop from 200% to 60%. Clearly the DEFENCE portion of the calculation is a massive shift in advantage to the towers. That was my original point.

 

[DeletedUser]

Hi
Have saturates so much whining !
Unload your unfounded frustration on neighbors and on the campaign map , which is why we are neighbors and the map !
Very courageous was the Administrator of this server ( like the French ) to warn us in advance of such changes , when in Beta , the silence on this matter is deafening !
Deal Castle and St. Basil will provide , at most , 60 % defense , but it added a feature that until now had not : 60 % of counterattack.
As for Zeus , Aachen and Del Monte , we , the overall offensive and defensive capabilities , while attacking , 90 % .
Equitable reduction will be made , which I think well .
The Watchfires not count toward GvG as well as the Monastery , so in the Provinces of GvG , all players will be standing EQUALITY .
We will have more losses in PvP ?
Oh yeah !
We'll use fewer automatic ?
Oh yeah !
The farmers are angry because the game finally gave more importance to the military side ?
We're sorry !
Standing applaud this profound change !
Now we get a little revelation of the Countess , if that is their desire to answer these questions :
Will the new GB modern era will have , as a bonus , 30 % attack and defense when attacked ?
Ie , does the new GB will be like Zeus , Aachen and Del Monte ?
So we have 60 % defense + 60 % counterattack in defense = 120 %
If the new GB get the same features as the current GB attackers , we have 90 % attack and defense when attacked , 30% more attack and defense = 120 %
Does it?
And when the coming of new GB ?...
Finally:
*Rather than lament an end, Battle for new beginnings!
(Google translate)

 

[Praeceptor]

Have saturates so much whining !
(Google translate)

I don't agree, but well done for the effort! Google translate is fantastic - brought a smile to my face!

 

[DeletedUser]

Le Google Translate est terrible

 

[DeletedUser]

I have 400% defense and someone with 105% boost still kill my troops every time ... so yes, I am very sure someone like him or with a better boost will beat AI after this update easy
and to not forget, I agree 100% with the french guy from above

 

[DeletedUser]

I have 400% defense and someone with 105% boost still kill my troops every time ... so yes, I am very sure someone like him or with a better boost will beat AI after this update easy
and to not forget, I agree 100% with the french guy from above

Yes, that's because the defensive balance DID need adjusting, but now your city is going to be all but impenetrable to ANYONE. 400% means you have 200% currently from watchtowers and monastery. That's not going to change. You're going to drop 140% on defense down to 260% defense but be given and added 60% bonus to attack while defending. Meanwhile your attackers are going to drop down to 90% (at max) against you. So.. 90/90 vs. 60/260. Yep, you win.

 

[DeletedUser3157]

Watchfire - Some of you have asked why we decided not to extend the rebalancing to include the watchfire. One thing we want to avoid in GvG is making it a pay-to-win feature, and so we have left it out of the feature, and have not included it in the rebalancing.

Hahaha. Oh girl u messed up so bad here, in some better forums you'd get ripped apart for leaving such a terrible opening

Example: So you are ok with leaving the entire rest of the game pay-to-win feauture, but not GvG?

 

[DeletedUser7719]

GvG is still a pay-to-win feature if you include revival/healing of units and payment of goods with diamonds.

The problem with watchfires is not GvG, but PvP - they're worth more defence each than a whole level of a DGB. That's ridiculous!

That's the whole point! We have to consider both sides of the coin, not just PvP

not if you do the math correct

one level DGB: 3% attack and 3% defense
one watchfire: 4% only on defense: so only have of the values are increased: effective 2%

2% is less than 3% (or 4% is less than 3%+3%)

and watchfires are only useful in PvP, so half your value again: 1% is less than 3%

 

[Praeceptor]

That's the whole point! We have to consider both sides of the coin, not just PvP...
and watchfires are only useful in PvP...

but I'm not interested in the other side of the coin byeordie - many of us have no interest at all in GvG - it's horribly stagnant on the server we're not allowed to mention here.

 

[DeletedUser7719]

Exactomiento, it looks unfair for most of us who are not participating in GvG, but it's still there, isn't it?
(It's kind of like saying that we're still waiting for two GBs for the ME )

 

[Praeceptor]

Exactomiento, it looks unfair for most of us who are not participating in GvG, but it's still there, isn't it?
(It's kind of like saying that we're still waiting for two GBs for the ME )

I think this would be easier to swallow if it was approached in a different way...

1. have GvG working properly first & get rid of the goods overhead (I'm not building a goods farm to participate, I'm a fighter!).
2. boost the def GBs without crippling the att GBs (I agree that this has been needed for some time).

Taking things away is always going to cause anger - perhaps that's why the needle is so pathetic - it won't need nerfing later.

 

[DeletedUser13805]

I have 400% defense and someone with 105% boost still kill my troops every time ... so yes, I am very sure someone like him or with a better boost will beat AI after this update easy
and to not forget, I agree 100% with the french guy from above

with 400% your bound to agree as you will benefit the most as i dont know if anyone will be able to beat your defense ? so if i end up in a hood with lots of players all on 400% and i can not beat there defense what happens to my game then ?

i face defenses with 300% and they have no attack boost so its going to be interesting to see how i do against them players with there new attack boost

i have always said the fairest way for all is no defense boost at all and this is why as to modify anything will benefit 1 set of players over the other there is no way to make it even unless the boosts are gone and then its down to troops and the stupid ai but at least it would be fair to all

 

[DeletedUser11899]

Players with maxed out boosts couldn't conquer the gvg continent in a day due to the goods demands. The siege army for the first sector costs 0 goods by the 20th sector a guild held it cost over 3,000 goods just to attempt to attack one sector. The issue with the GB boosts in gvg is greatly tips the advantage to the favor the defending guild. An attacking guild may have to win 80 or more battles to take a sector usually that will be against 50%-75% boosted defensive armies. On the other hand a defending guild member with a huge boost must only defeat the attackers 0% boosted siege army 10 times. A player with 3 maxed GB for a 150% boost can autobattle through a siege army in under 5 minutes and end an attack before it was started. Decreasing that players attack boost to only 100% will not change this in any way. On the other hand the majority of players will have a much harder time defeating 50-75% boosted defenses, now that they have a new lower attack boost of their own. Sectors which are almost impossible to take from a guild in gvg will just be that much harder to take now. gvg on Beta is basically stagnant to the imbalance which has just been made even worse by these changes.

Create a lot of sister guilds, siege and attack continuously a sector (or HQ sector) and this sector will fall in a couple of hours or less, then transfer the conquered sector to the mother guild and the map will be yours in a few days, because each siege made by all these coordinated sister guilds will only cost 5x5 goods.

I see this tactic every day in province map of Iron Age

 

[DeletedUser7046]

Create a lot of sister guilds, siege and attack continuously a sector (or HQ sector) and this sector will fall in a couple of hours or less, then transfer the conquered sector to the mother guild and the map will be yours in a few days, because each siege made by all these coordinated sister guilds will only cost 5x5 goods.

I see this tactic every day in province map of Iron Age

Looks easy that way...

and how do you transfer the sector the mother guild? As a gift?
To conquer each sector, the mother guild will need to set siege, battle and place defense and to do that, it'll be necessary goods...

 

[DeletedUser11899]

Looks easy that way...

and how do you transfer the sector the mother guild? As a gift?
To conquer each sector, the mother guild will need to set siege, battle and place defense and to do that, it'll be necessary goods...

once the sector protection ends, the mother guild places a siege army and attack to sister guild, which leaves only one weak defending army, i.e.
In all this process the cost for the mother guild is only one siege army, not several.

...and surely there will be other cheaper options :-)

 

[DeletedUser]

once the sector protection ends, the mother guild places a siege army and attack to sister guild, which leaves only one weak defending army, i.e.
In all this process the cost for the mother guild is only one siege army, not several.

...and surely there will be other cheaper options :-)

they are still saving goods in the case of any sectors that require more than 1 siege attempt. Each failure is much less costly. They are also requiring the other guild to spend WAAY more reclaiming things

 

[DeletedUser7046]

once the sector protection ends, the mother guild places a siege army and attack to sister guild, which leaves only one weak defending army, i.e.
In all this process the cost for the mother guild is only one siege army, not several.

...and surely there will be other cheaper options :-)

you didn't get the point. each adicional sector will cost more goods and there'll be a time when the goods will finhish. Why having 10 dummy guilds conquering setors if after the motherguild won't have goods for the siege?

 

[DeletedUser96867]

Create a lot of sister guilds, siege and attack continuously a sector (or HQ sector) and this sector will fall in a couple of hours or less, then transfer the conquered sector to the mother guild and the map will be yours in a few days, because each siege made by all these coordinated sister guilds will only cost 5x5 goods.

I see this tactic every day in province map of Iron Age

Or as one guild on the beta server has done, acquire between 50% and 75% of their sectors by sending in spies to other guilds to delete all their defenses. Taking 10 sectors in an hour without a single battle when it would normally had taken 800 battles to capture those sectors even if the defending guild had made no attempt to defend and replace damaged defenses. Perhaps if capturing a sector had a reasonable chance of succeeding guilds wouldn't have to resort to either the method you stated above, or the one i just mentioned.

Most guilds/players will not have the time and player involvement and interest to take on the method you describe, and after 2 months at least a minimal fix has been put in place to attempt to prevent the method i described. I hadn't considered the strategy you suggest before but i can see many elements that make it more costly and difficult to do than you suggest.

If taking a sector isn't to difficult as you suggest perhaps you can explain to me why there are so many higher age sectors with only 3 or 4 defensive armies put in place that none of the neighbors bother to attack.

 

[DeletedUser]

Please can I just add not to talk about what was or is happening on the beta server, there is a beta forum for those discussions, thanks every one. Also bear in mind anything that is happening there wont necessarily be the same when released to here anyway, kim.

 

[DeletedUser96695]

Hi

Deal Castle and St. Basil will provide , at most , 60 % defense , but it added a feature that until now had not : 60 % of counterattack.
As for Zeus , Aachen and Del Monte , we , the overall offensive and defensive capabilities , while attacking , 90 % .
Equitable reduction will be made , which I think well .
The Watchfires not count toward GvG as well as the Monastery , so in the Provinces of GvG , all players will be standing EQUALITY .
We will have more losses in PvP ?

(Google translate)

I am lost about it
as far as i know, GvG sector defense come from whole guild
The defend do not count whether a player has or has not watchfire...monastery
The defend bonus % is taken from whole guild ( sum of all GB who provide defend bonus + other defend structure ( like watch fire, monastery) )
Exact logic is unknown
it function like our battle in contential map and hoods, computer do the defense
there is no watchfire and monastery in GvG sector
as a player role in defending a sector, player is only providing defending armies while each sector consump part of the whole guild 's defending bonus
< defending army strength is not related with the provider, even provider have 300% defending bonus, his defending army 's defending with 0 to 50% (normal and maximum for non head quarter ), 0% defending bonus if there is no more remaining defending % from whole guild >
Including watchfire /monastery 's defending bonus only affect the amount of sector u can hold. E.g. your guild has 80 member, all with monastery, u will have 80X20% = 1600 % defending bonus due to monastery, each GvG sector need 50%, so u can hold another 32 ( 1600%/50% ) GvG sector due to monastery if the defending bonus logic of a GvG sector is purely a deduction.

The amount of GvG sector that a guild can hold depends on
(1) total defending bonus of a guild
(2) how the work with differenent age provinces, do they share or not
(3) amount of goods ....your 1st sector is a few goods, your 18th sector of a age may need over 300 goods < that is what i hear > ...

I totally lost when game developer say
"watchfire and monastry is not included in GvG"
It look to me, they try to limit the amount of sector u can hold in a age provinces and across all age provinces
nothing related with GvG sector battleing ( attack and defend bonus )

For me
their saying about GvG is just a excuse of that amendment
if they want to amend GvG , all amendment should make in GvG side, leave non-GvG (like attack bonus of zeus /aachen/ del monte ) unchanged

as far as i know
game developer never tell us..how those defending bonus logic is calcualted
if they do not include watchfire/monastry in GvG defending bonus, they do not need to inform us
prehaps some clever figure it is a simple summation and deduction of whole guild defending bonus
again, they can amended it as it is a beta ...no need to inform us