Inequality in Guild Battlegrounds

[shadowblackff]

What GbG needs is a good reason for a guild to hold a sector for more than 4 hours. Currently the only reason is to get more points, which is hardly enough.

 

[Rob The Gr8]

You are right. It will prevent guilds from teaming up to swap sectors for farming, cause there will be no need for that anymore. You just conquer a sector and immediately release it so you can do the same again and again every 4 hours.

But releasing a sector would be a last resort in an inactive or quiet GbG like I find myself in now. If there are just 2 active guilds the map swaps hand. I’m in a very GbG focused guild. We took the whole map in the first 20 mins but now we have only swapped a handful of sectors and we have owned the majority since day 1. That isn’t productive for anyone. By releasing sectors, at least we can fight for them again if nobody wants them…..

 

[Knight of ICE]

But releasing a sector would be a last resort in an inactive or quiet GbG like I find myself in now. If there are just 2 active guilds the map swaps hand. I’m in a very GbG focused guild. We took the whole map in the first 20 mins but now we have only swapped a handful of sectors and we have owned the majority since day 1. That isn’t productive for anyone. By releasing sectors, at least we can fight for them again if nobody wants them…..

Everybody wants those sectors. You just do not give them a chance. So you take a map in the first 20 minutes. Only way to do that is to build SC's and immediately complete them with diamonds. Nothing wrong with that, but if you do, you need to accept you demoralise all other Guilds. You can not expect them to start gaining sectors, just so you can fight again. I think you are creating your own problem and as a player I find it disgusting you want Inno to help you so you can shut out other Guilds even more. Take the entire map and then start releasng sectors so you can immediately take them again, with the result that others can not even take the few sectors anymore they can now.

 

[Rob The Gr8]

Everybody wants those sectors. You just do not give them a chance. So you take a map in the first 20 minutes. Only way to do that is to build SC's and immediately complete them with diamonds. Nothing wrong with that, but if you do, you need to accept you demoralise all other Guilds. You can not expect them to start gaining sectors, just so you can fight again. I think you are creating your own problem and as a player I find it disgusting you want Inno to help you so you can shut out other Guilds even more. Take the entire map and then start releasng sectors so you can immediately take them again, with the result that others can not even take the few sectors anymore they can now.

Ok. So the point of GbG is to fight, conquer sectors and come first; is it not?
We are quick off the mark, build the SC’s, gem them so others have a chance to inherit them when they follow us and effectively save their guild goods, but that is bad??
We reach out to the other guilds in slow rounds and explain to them how to follow us and save their attrition and guild goods so the sectors swap freely and everyone can enjoy GbG. That’s not disgusting.
What is disgusting is the fact that 90% of the guilds we reach out to tell us they have no desire to follow us and they want to be demoted to a lower league instead of the top league. This just emphasises the inequality in the matching of guilds for each round.
Does my idea has flaws, yes. Can they be resolved, yes. A simple solution to o stop guilds abusing it would be that a sector can only be released once a day by the owners. This removes the ability to take the sector and then release it again so it can be conquered by the same guild.
I thought this was a place to voice ideas and generate discussion, not a place to be told the way you approach the game is disgusting? Siping people’s BG’s and constantly attacking them and plundering them to drive them out of the game is disgusting but it happens many times in MK and I’ve seen it. But that is another discussion.

 

[Sir Lancelor]

Everybody wants those sectors. You just do not give them a chance. So you take a map in the first 20 minutes. Only way to do that is to build SC's and immediately complete them with diamonds. Nothing wrong with that, but if you do, you need to accept you demoralise all other Guilds. You can not expect them to start gaining sectors, just so you can fight again. I think you are creating your own problem and as a player I find it disgusting you want Inno to help you so you can shut out other Guilds even more. Take the entire map and then start releasng sectors so you can immediately take them again, with the result that others can not even take the few sectors anymore they can now.

What sort of an ignorant response is this? Do you actually play the game?

1. It's not a case of 1 guild not giving the other guilds a chance, its a case of bad matchmaking. So you have 1 active guild in amongst 6 guilds that barely login once a day and instead of admitting this is an issue, you blame the active guild? Just as an example, imagine matching a professional football team with a Park team and telling them there's no problem here and instead of beating them 5-0 you should beat them 1-0 to keep their spirits up.

2. The diamond issue, when the matchmaking works (and it does not often, we are rarely paired with the other top guild on the server), yes everyone spends diamonds to fly through the map, its how at works at the top level of BG. We spend approx 20-25k diamonds each BG to keep the map going on our end so maybe run your reply by your bosses before posting to see if they mind giving up the diamond purchases we do regularly.

Bottom line we are not stopping guilds from taking the map, their own inactivity and a terrible matchmaking system is. But by all means blame the players who play your game 12 hours a day for it being matched with people who maybe play 10 minutes

 

[Knight of ICE]

Ok. So the point of GbG is to fight, conquer sectors and come first; is it not?
We are quick off the mark, build the SC’s, gem them so others have a chance to inherit them when they follow us and effectively save their guild goods, but that is bad??
We reach out to the other guilds in slow rounds and explain to them how to follow us and save their attrition and guild goods so the sectors swap freely and everyone can enjoy GbG. That’s not disgusting.
What is disgusting is the fact that 90% of the guilds we reach out to tell us they have no desire to follow us and they want to be demoted to a lower league instead of the top league. This just emphasises the inequality in the matching of guilds for each round.

Perhaps you should read again. I did not say the way you play is disgusting. I said there is nothing wrong with that. I said that as a player I find it disgusting you are looking for changes so you can dominate even more. All you ask for is a solution so you can fight more.

Does my idea has flaws, yes. Can they be resolved, yes. A simple solution to o stop guilds abusing it would be that a sector can only be released once a day by the owners. This removes the ability to take the sector and then release it again so it can be conquered by the same guild.

So Guilds that do not want the sectors now are going to take them when you release them? What is the difference with sectors that are not released and they can still take?

What sort of an ignorant response is this? Do you actually play the game?

Ofcourse not. I don't play the game and you are not in the same Guild.

1. It's not a case of 1 guild not giving the other guilds a chance, its a case of bad matchmaking. So you have 1 active guild in amongst 6 guilds that barely login once a day and instead of admitting this is an issue, you blame the active guild? Just as an example, imagine matching a professional football team with a Park team and telling them there's no problem here and instead of beating them 5-0 you should beat them 1-0 to keep their spirits up.

I would say that calls for a solution to change the matchmaking. Not one that helps you to do more fights in a system you think is flawed. Extra matches against the Park team will not make the system any better.

 

[Rob The Gr8]

So Guilds that do not want the sectors now are going to take them when you release them? What is the difference with sectors that are not released and they can still take?

If you own the sector and they don’t want it, how can you retake it without anyone else capturing it? Hence the SLOW GbG’s because we are ALL mismatched 9/10 times.

 

[Rob The Gr8]

I said that as a player I find it disgusting you are looking for changes so you can dominate even more. All you ask for is a solution so you can fight more.

We are not looking for a way to further dominate. We are looking for a way to PLAY the game. A game that we are being stopped from playing due to the mismatches.

 

[Deleted member 127677]

The problem in all this is the mismatch. There has to be a better way than stagnant league points to determine who is on a board and who is not. If a guild of 70+ active Gbg focused members is deemed equal to a sub 10-member guild who aced it in plat and ended up on 1000 league points, is it any wonder that both sides may be asking for a change to how this works? Match guilds according to how many people are actually doing Gbg, the result could be quite interesting. I know in my world, there are many medium sized guilds with just a few people doing Gbg. Surely for them, it would be better to be matched to guilds with equal numbers of Gbg players than with guilds already 2-3 times bigger than them? Conversely, for those guilds who have been polishing their Gbg activity or maybe focus only on that for their game play, surely they should be matched with similar guilds, not with a lineup of guilds who even based on their membership can basically only fight, but most often have no chance of winning - hence the swap is the potentially easier option. If it’s about the win, give people a chance. If it’s not about the farm, change the system, as it is the inevitable result of the mismatch devs created.

 

[Deleted member 127677]

We are not looking for a way to further dominate. We are looking for a way to PLAY the game. A game that we are being stopped from playing due to the mismatches.

Actually, judging by what you posted before:

By releasing sectors, at least we can fight for them again if nobody wants them…

You don’t want to play the game, you want to get more fights.

 

[Rob The Gr8]

Actually, judging by what you posted before:

You don’t want to play the game, you want to get more fights.

Which is playing the game, is it not? Is GbG about fighting for sectors or taking a sector and letting it stagnate for 2 days before it’s taken by another guild?
It’s clear there is a massive inequality with matching guilds and that needs to urgently be addressed so the smaller guilds don’t become ‘demoralised’.

 

[shadowblackff]

Technically, GBG is about acquiring and holding sectors in order to earn Victory Points, which improves your position on the board, which in turn ddetermines your final GBG rewards for that round. The problem is that in practice the individual rewards we get from fighting or negotiating in GBG are far superior to the rewards we get from Victory Points, thus everyone is more interested in doing as many fights as possible and sectors are held only as long as necessary. Hence what I said earlier:

What GbG needs is a good reason for a guild to hold a sector for more than 4 hours. Currently the only reason is to get more points, which is hardly enough.

 

[Knight of ICE]

We are not looking for a way to further dominate. We are looking for a way to PLAY the game. A game that we are being stopped from playing due to the mismatches.

Accept you do not come up with a solution for what you call the mismatches, but you propose something that is totally in your favor. How is that not a way to further dominate?

Which is playing the game, is it not? Is GbG about fighting for sectors or taking a sector and letting it stagnate for 2 days before it’s taken by another guild?
It’s clear there is a massive inequality with matching guilds and that needs to urgently be addressed so the smaller guilds don’t become ‘demoralised’.

There are many ways to play the game. If you want a challenge, go dominate the map without using SC's. Their value is about to diminish anyhow, so you might as well start to practice.

And as far as what GBG is about, Inno has explained that.

What is "Guild Battlegrounds" about?

Within each battleground, the participating guilds will fight for victory by holding as many provinces as possible for as long as possible.

Looks like you are playing the game as it is intended and are looking for a way to play that isn't.

 

[Rob The Gr8]

Accept you do not come up with a solution for what you call the mismatches, but you propose something that is totally in your favor. How is that not a way to further dominate?

No, it’s a way to enjoy the game that I’ve invested years into playing. I would be interested to hear you suggestions as to how you think the GbG experience could be further enhanced for such scenarios.

Within each battleground, the participating guilds will fight for victory by holding as many provinces as possible for as long as possible.

Looks like you are playing the game as it is intended and are looking for a way to play that isn't.

So why allow them to be attacked after 4 hours? Why not just say whoever takes the most by the time the map of fully occupied is the winner?? Because the game has been designed so sectors swap hands and don’t just stay with 1 guild. If there is only 1 guild out of 7 with the desire to fight and capture them, there is NO competition and therefore you are NOT playing the game as intended.. surely you can see that?

There are many ways to play the game. If you want a challenge, go dominate the map without using SC's. Their value is about to diminish anyhow, so you might as well start to practice.

I’d doesn’t after to me/my guild if the sector we’re attacking has zero support or 6SC support, we will take it if it’s open regardless. In my opinion that’s a very provocative comment as you have no idea on our style of play.

 

[Knight of ICE]

No, it’s a way to enjoy the game that I’ve invested years into playing. I would be interested to hear you suggestions as to how you think the GbG experience could be further enhanced for such scenarios.

There are many players that have invested in the game and enjoy it and they might not agree with you. I showed you what GBG is about. You want it for personal benefit and profit. That is a different experience. As far as I am concerned it should not be changed for that.

So why allow them to be attacked after 4 hours? Why not just say whoever takes the most by the time the map of fully occupied is the winner??

Strange argument. You want GBG to last 1 hour every two weeks???? Fine by me if that makes you happy.

Because the game has been designed so sectors swap hands and don’t just stay with 1 guild. If there is only 1 guild out of 7 with the desire to fight and capture them, there is NO competition and therefore you are NOT playing the game as intended.. surely you can see that?

No. Again, it is designed for you to hold as many provinces as possible for as long as possible. If you have a desire to fight, you make sure you can fight. This may come as a shock to you, but as a result of your tactics it is very much possible those other 7 Guilds have a powwow and decide they will just let you sit there and just give you no more opportunities. That is what happens in the game, but since I do not play the game I might just be clutching at straws. ( great song btw)

I’d doesn’t after to me/my guild if the sector we’re attacking has zero support or 6SC support, we will take it if it’s open regardless. In my opinion that’s a very provocative comment as you have no idea on our style of play.

I find that a very strange comment. Didn't you explain the way you play? You take the whole map in 20 minutes by using diamonds to place SC's.

 

[Deleted member 127677]

Which is playing the game, is it not? Is GbG about fighting for sectors or taking a sector and letting it stagnate for 2 days before it’s taken by another guild?

The purpose of Gbg is in its name. It’s a battle. Not a swap. So, you won in the first 20 minutes. Mission accomplished. If the other guilds are playing some other part of the game, and are happy to come in whatever position they can get after you swept the map, are they not playing the game also? Maybe not within your concept of it, but certainly as much in keeping with the way GbG has been constructed as your version. Maybe the season coiuld also be shortened to an hour, once a day, at different times a day so everyone can be in on the action at some point. 10 days is way too long anyway. These are all things devs could have addressed a long time ago and didn‘t.

 

[Deleted member 127677]

Technically, GBG is about acquiring and holding sectors in order to earn Victory Points, which improves your position on the board, which in turn ddetermines your final GBG rewards for that round. The problem is that in practice the individual rewards we get from fighting or negotiating in GBG are far superior to the rewards we get from Victory Points, thus everyone is more interested in doing as many fights as possible and sectors are held only as long as necessary. Hence what I said earlier:

Agree. But there needs to be an overhaul generally. Originally, there was a claim that no GbG specific reward beyond prestige was needed, then it took them a few months (or maybe a tad longer) to release the SoH. That has been way surpassed by other things now also. So, the incentive for any guild that cannot compete for the victory, if they even want that, is not there. It’s all individual, but guild dependent. I think that is part of the general resentment, disinterest and dissatisfaction of GbG, certainly compared to Gvg.

 

[Deleted member 127677]

Strange argument. You want GBG to last 1 hour every two weeks???? Fine by me if that makes you happy.

Lots of people want GbG to last significantly shorter than it does now. I could see a scenario where it was 4 hours once a week, or an hour a day at different times or once a month for 8 hours, whatever would be better than what it is now. Which is over long, over demanding on peoples time and game enjoyment, and totally, completely over shadowing anything else people seem to be able to get out of the game.

 

[Rob The Gr8]

but since I do not play the game I might just be clutching at straws.

And there’s the problem. You’re trying to hold a discussion with me but you don’t play the game and have limited knowledge of the game. Play the game and see what you think.
Why don’t you hold a vote and see how many players are happy with the guild pairings in GbG? That will be the deciding factor.

 

[Knight of ICE]

Lots of people want GbG to last significantly shorter than it does now. I could see a scenario where it was 4 hours once a week, or an hour a day at different times or once a month for 8 hours, whatever would be better than what it is now. Which is over long, over demanding on peoples time and game enjoyment, and totally, completely over shadowing anything else people seem to be able to get out of the game.

I agree with you there, but I don't think it is just GBG. GBG is just part of it. It is the entire game with more events, mini games during those events, an extra lvl to GE and so on. It has almost become impossible to play the entire game. You need to make choices.

And there’s the problem. You’re trying to hold a discussion with me but you don’t play the game and have limited knowledge of the game. Play the game and see what you think.
Why don’t you hold a vote and see how many players are happy with the guild pairings in GbG? That will be the deciding factor.

And I am the one with limited knowledge about the game here? Let's see if you can figure out why that vote will not make sense.