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New Content Your First Great Building - A Guide Questline for New Players

  • Thread starter DeletedUser4727
  • Start date

DeletedUser4727

Hey guys,

As explained in the announcement, we're looking to make some improvements to the early game process for new players. The first of these improvements is a guide to their first great building!

Check out the full details here.

Any questions of feedback, put them in this thread :)

Thanks
Richard and team
 

DeletedUser96901

Please note that the questline will not be shown to players who are farther down the tech-tree than mid-Iron Age.
wouldn't it be more logical that the condition would be if a player already has a GB

because you call it "Your First Great Building"
and it can't be the first GB for players who already have at least one GB

:rolleyes:
 

DeletedUser111268

its a great idea for new comers to have this GB and learn more about GBs and how to level them..
 

DeletedUser111589

wouldn't it be more logical that the condition would be if a player already has a GB

because you call it "Your First Great Building"
and it can't be the first GB for players who already have at least one GB

:rolleyes:

Exactly. I got my first GB on main world just few days before going up to HMA
 

DeletedUser100832

I am not sure this is a good idea. Making people build and spend fp on a gb that may be useless in the long run is a terrible strategy.

I didn't have any GB's until HMA, and to be honest I am glad I didn't spend a lot of fp before I knew what I was doing.
 

DeletedUser111351

I must say from the sound of how this is being implemented, I agree with @Medribradrion. The concept of introducing new players to GBs is great. Explaining how it works and getting them started and understanding it through a tutorial has some real merit.

That said, I started playing not that long ago. I started getting blueprints and would see all these GB in various other players' cities and wanted one too. Finally I got a full set for one. It happened to be the Colosseum. I saw how medals could be used to grow the size of my city and thought, yes, a source of medals. This building will pay for its own space in no time at all and will be fantastic.

I went to build it and of course it is huge. At such a young age my city was so small that giving up so much space was a severe constraint, but I did it anyway. Then I started instantly putting FP into it to build it up. It didn't take too long to buy an expansion or two with medals, but most of those medals were actually won by other means. The GB helped, but quickly I was realizing that expansion costs were growing at a much faster pace than that Colosseum would ever produce. The GB just wasn't worth it. I trashed the GB and was rather annoyed by how much wasted effort and, more importantly, FP I had thrown into the thing.

Had I been a bit more lucky and my first set of BP just happened to been Zeus or something else, I would have been much better off. I still have my Zeus now. Granted, it may have just pushed the Colosseum discovery a bit down the road. Who's to say if I would have only figured out that I didn't want the Colosseum after I had built it, or learned enough about the game to forego it from the start.

Now Inno plans to force the Colosseum issue that I had onto every player. In your own words, "[the Oracle] not really that interesting for advanced users." So you are going to excite players about their first GB. They are going to flood it with their FP, slowing their tech advancement considerably. The at some point they will find the GB has no more value to them and they'll need to trash it or feel stuck with it because they don't want to abandon something they put so much FP into.

I say keep the Oracle. Keep the tutorial. But overhaul it to be more like the Longhouse. Do not allow players to put FP into the building, either their own or others. Create an oracle voucher or some such whereby this token is used to upgrade the GB and they are earned through the tutorial and quest system. Or have FP given to the player (like the diamonds for the longhouse) and then forcibly applied directly to the FP through a tutorial like lock-in that doesn't allow them to put that FP elsewhere.

Basically, give new players their first GB and give them everything that will be put into that GB. Allow them to put nothing of their own into it. Just like the Longhouse, introduce them to the new concept. Walk them through the steps. Let them keep the freebie as long as they want. But keep its value limited so eventually they'll get rid of it and replace it with things they earn and build.

The other option I see would be to have some sort of Oracle recuperation event. Rather than just destroying the Oracle as with other GB, allow players to transfer the FP to a another built GB of their choice or some other means of getting back a good portion of what was spent on the GB. Or maybe just a 1 time offer gets added to the quest tree. A single quest is added into the storyline at the end of Iron Age or EMA or wherever deemed likely that the Oracle's usefulness is likely to start to decline. This quest offers a one-time chance to destroy the oracle through this quest and get some quality something in return (be it a direct FP prize or something else that makes having built that forced GB into a worthwhile task rather than something that hindered them in the long run).
 

Vesiger

Monarch
Agreed - the general idea of a GB tutorial quest is a good one, but if you're intentionally introducing an obligatory GB with no long-term value then you need to introduce a way of getting rid of it, plus the idea that they will need to do so.
A destroy-the-Oracle quest sounds like a good idea - perhaps with an enlightenment or rise of a new religion storyline theme?
 

DeletedUser111351

Observatory would do as well.
Observatory is too powerful, as well as currently somewhat challenging to get to just give it away for free. Not to mention all the squawking that would occur by anyone somewhat advanced that hasn't gotten the Observatory and doesn't get a chance to do this new quest and get it for free.

As I alluded to and @mrbeef said, Zeus would be the ideal candidate for a freebie keeper. The throwaway concept of the new GB also has merit. They just need to remove the part where it stunts the growth of young players.

If they find my above rant too complex and they aren't willing to spend the time making such a dramatic redesign of something they've already coded (because they do the work and then ask for suggestions), I do believe they could do a minimalist correction to lessen the damage at least. Cap the oracle growth at level 3 or so. Consider reducing the forge point cost required to get it to level 3. In short, don't allow a player to throw a ton of forge points into this soon-to-be-dead building. It isn't an ideal solution, but it would minimize the growth stunting of young players, minimize the frustration/loss when the building is trashed, and likely minimizes the code changes required.
 

DeletedUser103223

Let the oracle give a small Coin boost % instead of supplys and anyone could use it forever at the size it is.
 

Andrew420

Major
The idea to make an exclusive GB just for this quest line is the right call
It just makes sense to give away a lesser valued GB
Why should the new players be given a GB that the rest of us had to earn
Let them go out and earn it after they learn from the oracle
Its appropriate that the tutorial GB wont be valuable for long
That way they can learn the lesson don't build a GB until you can determine its usefulness
 

DeletedUser111027

I think the idea is a great one, but I think that if long-term the building is not going to be pulling its weight, then make it smaller. If it was 2x2, then players will be less fussed about the space taken up by the decreasingly-useful GB, so that by the time they ditch it altogether they've received enough benefit from it in the meantime to justify the sunk cost.
 

DeletedUser111351

I think the idea is a great one, but I think that if long-term the building is not going to be pulling its weight, then make it smaller. If it was 2x2, then players will be less fussed about the space taken up by the decreasingly-useful GB, so that by the time they ditch it altogether they've received enough benefit from it in the meantime to justify the sunk cost.
Space isn't the problem. The building is going to produce supplies and it will produce enough to outshine normal supply producers of the low ages relative to space used.

The problem is that GBs cost a player FP to build and grow. FPs are the bottleneck in this game and the true primary resource. The younger a player is, the more critical every single FP is. A player who builds this GB will be less advanced than one who does not build it. A player who grows this GB will be even less so.

If the player goes on to play this game for 2 years, will the fact that his city wasted/lost 3 days worth of advancement in the early stages of the game really matter? Not so much. But over the short term it will matter. Granted, I don't think any of us have seen the "actual tutorial." So a lot of this is conjecture based on the limited glimpses they have shown.
 

DeletedUser104719

I agree with many points above:
- The idea is great! It took me a very long time to work out what GBs were and how they worked.
- I love the idea of a new, modest GB specifically for the quest.
- Don't allow new players to sink up to 2010 (!!!!) FP into something they're likely to want to ditch later!!

On that 3rd point, several good suggestions have already been made:
- switch for a % boost, coin or supply, which can remain useful but not overpowered
- limit level to keep FP investment down, so when it's time to ditch it's less painfull
- provide a return on investment when it does get torn down

Also, maybe give the quest line to everyone, but let advanced users abort it? Might just be me, but I'd kinda love to see it :)
 
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DeletedUser111024

If i am currently finishing the Iron age tech tree will i be able to do this quest?
 

DeletedUser111387

So is it available only for those players who are tiptoeing in the first half of their Iron Age? Why not give an opportunity to players who want to stay in the Bronze Age and develop their BA city as much as they can?
 
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