• Dear forum reader,
    To actively participate in our forum discussions or to start your own threads, in addition to your game account, you need a forum account. You can
    REGISTER HERE!
    Please ensure a translation into English is provided if your post is not in English and to respect your fellow players when posting.
  • We are looking for you!
    Always wanted to join our Support or Forum Team? We are looking for enthusiastic moderators!
    Take a look at our recruitment page for more information and how you can apply:
    Apply
  • Forum Contests

    Won't you join us for out latest contest?
    You can check out the newest one here.

Make Great Buildings support rewards available to Guild members only.

DeletedUser

Sorry, but what exactly is greedy about having a Guild only option? In matter of fact it would be less greedy, since they are not wanting the extra help and for the game design it has nothing to do with it. Games are always evolving to meet players needs

By "greedy" i assume keeping the B.P's for select few. Imagine how unbalanced will things get if all people who use diamonds to progress/build G.B.'s get in 2-3 guilds and not allow anyone to donate on their G.B.'s.

Everyone else who does not use diamonds will be highly disadvantaged.
 
Last edited by a moderator:

DeletedUser

By "greedy" i assume keeping the B.P's for select few. Imagine how unbalanced will things get if all people who use diamonds to progress/build G.B.'s get in 2-3 guilds and not allow anyone to donate on their G.B.'s.

Everyone else who does not use diamonds will be highly disadvantaged.

Ok I still don't get your point, seeing how diamond users already have the advantage. Also I'm sure if they added the guild only option, not every player would keep it inside the guild and let the non-diamond users have the chance to gain Bp's.
 

DeletedUser8813

But if it's a "guild only option" you can still have friends/neighbours helping towards your Great buildings, so this idea won't affect you.
If it is a guild only option ,that means only guild members get the rewards,why would friends and neighbors then donate if they get nothing for it.
I know i wouldn't give up my forge points if there was no reward
so it is still a -1 from me
 

DeletedUser4202

Neighbors and friends can´t donate forge points if someone makes their building guild only. ONLY the guild can donate. People could still get neighbors to donate by not clicking guild-only.

+1 for me
A guild only option lets players chose if they want only their guild to donate or if they want neighbors to contribute too.
 

DeletedUser7719

1) resentment that top rewards for supporting are going outside the Guild...
...clearly damaging to Guild morale...
These are pretty valid points on most of the GBs I have seen. The other winners are the guildies at the end of the tech tree which we could gladly reason with when we do want to try to gain some BPs. Some guildies like it because they want there GB to progress faster; others do not because they wanted the guildies/friends to benefit from this. Having a guild-Only option would be a comprimise between these two arguments, so a +1 to that idea
 

DeletedUser

They have only 4 or 5 buildings, Gods of War - 14...

Must be getting harder to level them up with just guild FP.
And yes, without outside contribution more BP will go to guild members but what good is it to having a level 1 building and waiting weeks for it to go up one level.
At low levels, the bonus they give is just not worth the space they take.
As i said in a another post: first 3-4 weeks of GB, players will be frustrated by high contribution competition. After that, players will be frustrated that it will take forever to bring their beloved GB to level 5,6 and getting to level 10 will be "wow"
By the time, this discussion has stopped and this idea has made it to developer's long list of consideration, same players in favor of it here, will scream "Come oh dear neighbor, come and spend FP on my GB please. Developers, damn you for not making GB available to neighbors."

All in all, i support the later version of the idea of having a "switch" for neighbors contribution. An option that can be turned on only when the building level is at 0 FP (not fair to have neighbors donate and turn it off midway so guild can get top ranks. aha) :)
 

DeletedUser

I personally have reached somewhat of a stunt in my tech tree. I've been having immense difficulty with stagnant markets, above all else. I build up a bunch of materials that I don't need in order to trade, trade a 2:1 rate, even for things of the same level, have begun opening it up to neighbors and not just guild mates.... and yet I'm still progressing at one tech every few days at most. That's not to mention the devastating stunt in my continent map, being unable to trade my way through, and because of supplies, also unable to fight my way through. I'm at an impass with points, and with 10 just lingering and lingering, I felt like they were just going to waste! Well, I decided to start pouring my Forge Points into my neighbor's Great Building. I thought, "Wow, this is a great chance to help out a neighbor!" I wasn't at all concerned with scavenging Blue Prints or even the other prizes. I just had stores of points (including from the Christmas events) and started donating them (notice the word donate.)

Right now, none of my guild mates or friends have Great Buildings, so I can't turn to them, and only one neighbor has a Great Building. I finally feeling like I can put those Forge Points to use, even if it's with the intent of helping another. If I do win some Forge Points for my donations, I'm thinking I might invest those right back into that neighbor's Great Building (unless the market finally start's picking up!) I'm a very centrist person and tend to deviate from the extremes, or - essentially - the 'opposing sides.' So I do like the idea of being able to choose whether you want your Great Building to be guild-only donations or not. I am totally against making it so that it is guild only for everyone, though, as I feel that has more of a chance to hurt more people than help (but, then again, if you're lobbying for that, and you're one of those people who would be helped, why would you care about the suffering of other players? But aren't ideas often voted against for selfish purposes - meaning you stand to really gain something from it when others might be hurt? I'd call that viable for abuse.) So my vote goes to either each person having a choice, or keeping it as it is.
 

DeletedUser7837

+1 to "Guild Only option"

Just like trades which there is a "Guild only Option" we should have this option on our great buildings. ofcourse Neighbors can still polish/motivate/plunder to get blueprints



Please be more polite SlickR, you will solve nothing if you are going to act frustrated.

As for me, still -1 for the idea.

Why?
I will say this again: The game is designed around community building and increasing the number of connections between players. As you can see almost none of the main attributes of this game have an option to 'be selfish'. You can only win here by being the best and not by being greedy.

What about 'Be Selfish' option in Trades ( Guild only ) which is definitely a main attribute of the game since everyone need to trade ?
 
Last edited by a moderator:

DeletedUser9815

Not a fan of this idea, at first you think it wise...wait too you have 20 plus great buildings in your guild, tec research would slow and so would the guild...I welcome the help of there neighbors!
 

DeletedUser

+1 to "Guild Only option"

Just like trades which there is a "Guild only Option" we should have this option on our great buildings. ofcourse Neighbors can still polish/motivate/plunder to get blueprints





What about 'Be Selfish' option in Trades ( Guild only ) which is definitely a main attribute of the game since everyone need to trade ?

You are correct, in a way. However, when trading you do not 'create' wealth you more or less exchanges the same amount of money into another form. But, when you win in Great Buildings, you directly create wealth out of the blue, which consequently creates a greater imbalance when it is 'kept away from others'.

IMHO, hope this answered your question. If not, i am willing to listen to your motives.
 

DeletedUser

-10 for an incredibly short-sighted and fairly selfish idea.

  1. no guild players
    not all of us actually want to join a guild. some of us are fiercely independant sorts who network outside of formal structures and build a web of friendships in the game. of course, women are better at this, i can see your problem there.
  2. small guilds
    the proposal favours only the big guilds, top players and redaction would clear everybody else off the board by simply swapping members everyday. smaller guilds with less connections would be left wondering how you even get a building to level 1, you've taken no account of the fact that the vast majority of guilds are about 30 members or less. check your server stats.
  3. development crippled
    we are going to struggle long and hard to get these blueprints. i don't have a bottomless credit card and will need to think long and hard about buying the diamonds to complete which ever GB stops giving me nothing but duplicates everytime. why are you trying to make this even harder?
  4. top end players
    by the time you get to the very top there is little to do accept be benevolent and generous to lower point players. nice to spread a bit of warmth to friends and players further done especially with all the lovely forge point bonuses coming in. if your guild has no GB's in development, what are you to do if you can't help a friend with them?
  5. excessive diamond advantage
    you are piling huge advantages into the hands of premium players, the balance you are talking about is going to be thrown out with the bathwater here. do you think diamond players need your input? nope, they can buy themselves as many levels as they want. the rest of us have to struggle with the on the hour drip. you have handed the game to premium players with one silly idea!
  6. guild leader abuse
    now we get to the dirty bit. if a guild leader is smart enough and has a few sidekicks, they can quite easily demand the entire guild focuses on making them more powerful. using threat, pressure and social engineering, entire groups of people can be manipulated for one person alone. by herding your sheeple into an ever tighter focus on guilds, you are taking down every fence to stop this evil sort of player abuse entire sections of the game community. i have CSA'd games before and seen this happen, and it destroys games for 100's of players.
  7. neighbourhood characteristics
    every neighbourhood is different. some of them are infested rat's nests in total war. others are fairly peaceful rub along and dish out the occasional poking places. some of them, we even like to help our neighbours rather than just plundering them endlessly. it certainly makes the game more social and fun, if you can pop next door and help a friend who decently has left you unplundered because the game's AI can't defend itself for toffees.
  8. newbie farming
    newbies need to put their forge points into tech tree progress. not being coerced by guilds into supporting GB's. constrict use of forge points to guilds and i can guarantee you will get newbies being "pumped and dumped" by the large guilds all over. the game is bad enough for dumping newbies into neighbourhoods of higher level players, only to be eaten alive in a feeding frenzy. you're just adding to this problem.
  9. game philosophy
    this whole game is focused into something uncomfortably between Lag-goonia and Tribal Wars. it is competitive but has neat social touches which bring in a more mature (and richer) player base. the long term survival of a games company is down to a healthy philosophy and managing to accommodative the styles of the most players. if you want a game totally focused on guilds and having only the strongest and biggest survive, go and play Tribal Wars, if you like just being meat on the bone.
  10. short sighted selfish suggestions
    any game is bigger than you. everybody plays for different reasons. you deliberately are - and admit to - excluding entire sections of the player base and push your own selfish agenda. try looking beyond your nose a bit at the reasons why people play the game, and be inclusive of every playing style. if you don't, you are slicing off large chunks of the player base, large chunks of which pay Inno a lot of money. suggesting Inno cut off their money supply will go down like 2 days production of bricks and has ZERO chance of the developers taking you, and any future suggestions you have remotely seriously.

-10 and you deserve every neg.


tracey
in a lot of pain this morning and looking at the prospect of only a sock full of coal tomorrow*

---

* a sock full of coal will keep me warm for a night. bring it on.
 
Last edited by a moderator:

DeletedUser7719

-10 and you deserve every neg.
Let me start right here; I do not think this person deserves every neg just because he came up with an idea :confused:
1. no guild players
not all of us actually want to join a guild. some of us are fiercely independant sorts who network outside of formal structures and build a web of friendships in the game. of course, women are better at this, i can see your problem there.
Ok, there is suppose to be a point in why there are guilds in this game. If people don't want to join them, it should be their loss (but if you're including friends I think a guild only option should still include friends since you/they should act formally to help elevate a GB)
2. small guilds
the proposal favours only the big guilds, top players and redaction would clear everybody else off the board by simply swapping members everyday. smaller guilds with less connections would be left wondering how you even get a building to level 1, you've taken no account of the fact that the vast majority of guilds are about 30 members or less. check your server stats.
I'm a little confused here, how would not having a guild-only option affect this?
3. development crippled
we are going to struggle long and hard to get these dang blueprints. unlike you, i don't have a bottomless credit card and will need to think long and hard about buying the diamonds to complete which ever GB stops giving me nothing but duplicates everytime. why the hell are you trying to make this even harder?
Ummm, I don't use diamonds. I'm trying to use patience to wait for my blueprints (even though that's not working out well :p). I do try and contribute to my guildies' GBs, but I never do too much because that would hinder my development across the tech tree.
4. top end players
by the time you get to the very top there is little to do accept be benevolent and generous to lower point players. nice to spread a bit of warmth to friends and players further done especially with all the lovely forge point bonuses coming in. if your guild has no GB's in development, what are you to do if you can't help a friend with them?
I'm pretty sure the top end players are already in a guild which already has a GB, and if they aren't, they are most likely using diamonds. If it's none of those, then I would like to include friends in the Guild-Only option and go find one.
5. excessive diamond advantage
you are piling huge advantages into the hands of premium players, the balance you are whining about is going to be thrown out with the bathwater here. do you think diamond players need your input? nope, they can buy themselves as many levels as they want. the rest of us have to struggle with the on the hour drip. you have handed the game to premium players with one silly idea!
Diamond players have an advantage. What's new about that? What is trying to be done is helping out some guildies that are not aiming to buy diamonds for their GB. Neighbors taking all the rewards ruin the guild morale for even having GBs.
6. guild leader abuse
now we get to the dirty bit, you are obviously an inexperienced player with no idea how nasty these games can get. if a guild leader is smart enough and has a few sidekicks, they can quite easily demand the entire guild focuses on making them more powerful. using threat, pressure and social engineering, entire groups of people can be manipulated for one person alone. by herding your sheeple into an ever tighter focus on guilds, you are taking down every fence to stop this evil sort of player abuse entire sections of the game community. i have CSA'd games before and seen this happen, and it destroys games for 100's of players.
Well then that is a pathetic guild; I would leave immediately, and aim for another guild.
7. neighbourhood characteristics
every neighbourhood is different. some of them are infested rat's nests in total war. others are fairly peaceful rub along and dish out the occasional poking places. some of them, we even like to help our neighbours rather than just plundering them endlessly. it certainly makes the game more social and fun, if you can pop next door and help a friend who decently has left you unplundered because the game's AI can't defend itself for toffees.
Ok, your assuming he/she is going to use the guild-only option which means that he didn't like some of those "peaceful" neighbors who have been stealing blueprints that he/she wanted his/her guildies to take. If you were a friendly-enough neighbor, you could try to be friends to help contribute.
8. newbie farming
newbies need to put their forge points into tech tree progress. not being coerced by guilds into supporting GB's. constrict use of forge points to guilds and i can guarantee you will get newbies being "pumped and dumped" by the large guilds all over. the game is bad enough for dumping newbies into neighbourhoods of higher level players, only to be eaten alive in a feeding frenzy. you're just adding to this problem.
I don't see how this option specifically adds more newbie farming...
9. game philosophy
this whole game is focused into something uncomfortably between Lag-goonia and Tribal Wars. it is competitive but has neat social touches which bring in a more mature (and richer) player base. the long term survival of a games company is down to a healthy philosophy and managing to accommodative the styles of the most players. if you want a game totally focused on guilds and having only the strongest and biggest survive, go and play Tribal Wars, if you like just being meat on the bone.
Sorry, I don't get the point your trying to make here, including since your using the word "uncomfortably". Doesn't that mean you don't like this game?

Finally, last one:):
10. short sighted selfish suggestions
any game is bigger than you. everybody plays for different reasons. you deliberately are - and admit to - excluding entire sections of the player base and push your own selfish agenda. try looking beyond your nose a bit at the reasons why people play the game, and be inclusive of every playing style. if you don't, you are slicing off large chunks of the player base, large chunks of which pay Inno a lot of money. suggesting Inno cut off their money supply will go down like 2 days production of bricks and has ZERO chance of the developers taking you, and any future suggestions you have remotely seriously.
Please try and be more respectful to others. I really doubt they were trying to be selfish when they thought of this idea.

So in conclusion, I think friends should be part of the Guild-Only Option because they should understand you if you wanted to help out another guildy with your GB
 
Last edited by a moderator:

DeletedUser

The following points are a response to the counter-arguments in the post above:
1. Not joining a guild should never be a loss. It would mean an inbalance in the game. Joining a guild merely opens up more opportunities, but not ones that topple the balance of the game really. You should not be penalized or disadvantaged for not joining a guild.

2. The point was that -when activated- larger guilds would benefit rediculously in comparison to smaller guilds or independant players. Balance topple.

3. You're taking the response that was directed at someone else personally and fail to respond to the second part of the statement, which included the point: this will make it even harder to get BPs for players that are not in large guilds.

4. As you showed, there are a lot of "if's" required to render her point invalid, so it's a good point.

5. Basically you say it's unfair that others are interfering in building the GB. It's a MMO Game.. expect others to interact with eachother. Especially with a project like a GB. I think that was also one of the points of the GBs: More interaction with eachother.

6. Leaving the guild would be a personal choice and does not render her point invalid. Even though such things can be reported under the banner of threat/blackmail, they do happen.

7. Your take on this is wrong. Neighbours are not "stealing" BPs. You cannot say "they're meant for the guildies". That's not how the system works and assuming that is a bit ignorant to be honest. It does explain some of your views and answers.

8. I suppose her point was referring to #6. But I agree that in itself this idea would not specifically add to newbie farming.

9. Her point is made in the last sentence. This suggested idea would make this game a lot more Guild focused, which brings us back to my point in #1.

10. To be honest, if you take a good look at the idea, I'd say that there is definitely some selfish motives there. If not only selfish for their guild.

So in conclusion I believe that (although a bit bluntly put) Tracey has made some valid points as to why this idea isn't very optimal for the game.
Adding an option like this would definitely create some elitist groups and kill the goal of the devs to interact more with eachother through the GB feature.

Ofcourse it is annoying if a neighbour snatches the BPs you were after, but it's not like they're stealing it. Not for free at least. They receive that BP as a reward. A reward for contributing a lot of points.
That you (generally speaking) are unable to compete with that is not their fault. They shouldn't be penalized for winning.

- L
 

DeletedUser7719

Dang, I do not like to counter ten-point arguments :(:
1. If you have less opportunities that is a loss
2. That's like saying having bigger neighborhoods would benefit compared to smaller
3. Okay, another argument on smaller guilds; I don't get why larger guilds shouldn't have more of an advantage anyways
4. :D...
Wait a sec what does this post on 0.22 Announcements say?
The Great building are a new and exiting feature which allow players to aid their friends and guild members in constructing unique buildings with powerful bonuses.
Hmmm, I actually don't see neighbors on that
 

DeletedUser

1. It's not a loss, it's a choice. Like having whipped cream on your icecream or not. Both work. But this point is actually off topic.
2. That is true.
3. This was not about smaller guilds, but guildless players. If you exclude them through this idea, they're gonna have a darn hard time gathering BPs.

Me neither, and yet they can contribute. :D
Guess they forgot to add that, I'll make sure someone notifies the devs to reprogram their announcement rob- oh wait, he's human too. ;)

- L
 

DeletedUser

Wait a sec what does this post on 0.22 Announcements say?

The Great building are a new and exiting feature which allow players to aid their friends and guild members in constructing unique buildings with powerful bonuses.

Hmmm, I actually don't see neighbors on that

Maybe that's because the friends and guildies would do it to aid each other. Whereas neighbours would do this out of greed? ;)
I find it sad that so many people are only willing to help their friends / guildmembers to build their Great Buildings so they can get more Blueprints. Whatever happened to just being happy to help?

~Mutzena~
 

DeletedUser

Maybe that's because the friends and guildies would do it to aid each other. Whereas neighbours would do this out of greed? ;)
I find it sad that so many people are only willing to help their friends / guildmembers to build their Great Buildings so they can get more Blueprints. Whatever happened to just being happy to help?

~Mutzena~

As I stated above, I didn't think about any of these apparently 'selfish' and 'thieving' motives for contributing to a neighbor's Great Building when I started donating Forge Points. I simply wanted to aid him in advancing his building. I don't even plan on constructing a Great Building anywhere on the horizon. The person who I contributed to was a neighbor, and was also the only person I knew who had a Great Building, including friends, guild members, and other neighbors. Also, despite being the top player in the neighborhood, they were nice enough to aid my city, not attack and plunder it (unlike the two neighbors ranked just below him.) I thought I was doing an act of kindness and little else. I even tossed the Forge Points I got as a reward right back into the his Great Building! However, after reading some of the posts in this thread, I sent a message asking if he wanted me to let his guild members (I only saw one contribute that was in his guild) get the rewards, and I didn't hear back. I tried to contribute only a handful to give any of his guild members a very fair chance while not completely depriving him of my Forge Points should he have actually wanted them.
 

DeletedUser7837

Another Important reason for +1 to this Idea would be Guild wars which will come in Future Updates As blacksmith told us here Link

Allowing opposing guilds to steal your guild's Blueprints will be a bad idea there
 
Last edited by a moderator:
Top