HQ being granted freedom?

[DeletedUser99445]

Lufty...It's not ruining the game for all.
It is upsetting you and others but it isn't ruining the game for everyone.
Some are happy to adapt and the strongest players here are the ones who can adapt the fastest. It's a little like real life in that way.

 

[DeletedUser1081]

Guilds that want to try it but are worried that it's "dishonourable" should be able to find willing opponents who also enjoy this style of GvG. I reckon more and more guilds will gradually see the light, release most of their hexes and join in. The devs will come up with some other use for goods in the treasury and it'll all fall into place.

 

[DeletedUser99445]

Guilds that want to try it but are worried that it's "dishonourable" should be able to find willing opponents who also enjoy this style of GvG. I reckon more and more guilds will gradually see the light, release most of their hexes and join in. The devs will come up with some other use for goods in the treasury and it'll all fall into place.

I would like to see a free for all where we can fight without restriction of goods and let our armies do the talking.
A proper war zone to battle for supremacy.

 

[DeletedUser1081]

I would like to see a free for all where we can fight without restriction of goods and let our armies do the talking.
A proper war zone to battle for supremacy.

I can see how that would be fun. Maybe they should open up a new GvG zone explicitly for that.
In the current maps too many players feel "ohhhh noooo we've invested soooooo much in winning/defending these hexes", so the idea of releasing them in order to have some fun feels downright perverted, I guess. So they have the joy of scrounging endlessly for goods in order to watch stagnant maps dry. Whee

 

[mrbeef]

I read ages ago that there was going to be a 'age-free' zone. Can't recall exactly when, beginning of this year sometime.

 

[DeletedUser13082]

@Lufty, you know better than most that I've always been dead set against the idea of ghost guilds and such like, but look at the game, what are we supposed to do. Our goods costs are so high it takes weeks for us to afford a single siege. Due to the lack of action, more than half of the fighters in the guild got bored and quit playing cause there's nothing else to do when gathering goods. So now we use a demolition guild instead.

As for the sectors we "lost", if you're referring to the modern era map then you should double check. We released sectors so we could attack for a while, OoB took the last sector which we planned on holding onto. As for only targeting OoB guilds, ask chuck yourself, I've already said that in the long run we will be hitting everybody whether friends in the guild or not. OoB have always been our main enemy so obviously our first target is always going to be your guilds.

If you really want to go down the road of agreement breaking. We wasn't the ones who started releasing sectors just to do damage to other guilds. That was Jai and the rest of OoB. It's exactly the same as what we're doing now, we're just doing it on a larger scale. Enjoying the game by ensuring we have cheaper costs. Our new guild is gaining more and more members and others are showing interest now too. Everybody wants to be able to enjoy the game whenever they can get time to play, not once a fortnight when they've managed to gather enough goods.

The goal of the new guild in the long run isn't to just keep causing hassle for other guilds on a small scale, that's just what we're doing for the time being until we gather enough fighters together. The long term plan, once we have enough players, is to completely wipe an entire map as quickly as we can. Hopefully that will finally prove to developers that things need changing. Others might not be in it for that specific reason, they just want to jump in and have some fun, but that's the goal for me, anybody who wants to come along is welcome to do so. If goods costs were changed I'd 100% go back to playing properly, but the way they are set now, It's either do this and enjoy the game, or quit the game cause there's nothing else to do. I'm choosing to carry on, and yes, for a change, I'm taking the low road. Blame Inno, not me.

 

[DeletedUser97768]

@DO: In that case, I would like to see you use this on AA and see if they like it. Or see if any of them join your demo guild.
They are after all the #1 guild with no one even close....But will you do it? No you wont. Because you'd like to keep the balance of power and whittle away the OoB. Once you've used this tactic to get rid of OoB sectors, you'll revert back to the old style of play saying something like 'well, looks like the demo thing didnt work after all...might as well use this demo guild as a normal guild and start afresh'. Would be a lot easier considering that you've now wiped away the opposition using ghosting tactics. After all, you came up with this idea after Titans lost a whole bunch of sectors while you were away, and not just on the ME map either...just saying..

As for agreement breaking, I admit OoB used ghosting tactics first, which is why we all came to an 'Agreement'. But no one has since broken the Agreement, until now that is.

To be honest, I like your idea of keeping a constant seige cost - in fact I brought this up on the forums a long time ago as well. But demolishing the GvG is not the proper means to this end. INNO will do what they want to do irrespective of what you do in one world. But in the meantime, its ruining things for everyone else.

My guild is not a big one, and we struggled hard to get where we are without help from anyone for the most part. I for one would not want to see all that effort go down the drain.

I suggest we plod on under the rules of the game until INNO open their eyes and change them for the better - hopefully before it is too late. If they dont, well there are many other online games out there...

In the end, the same rules apply to all. If you say that ghosting is within the rules of the game, then I would like to invoke Rule 6 of the In-game rules, regarding abuse of the system. And if ghosting is not an abuse of the system, then I dont know what is.

Besides, I think the developers are already aware of the problems with GvG. There are enough and more posts about it on the forum and I'm sure they pop in here every once in a while or the mods keep them informed of trends. Wiping away entire maps has been done on other worlds as well. They are probably working on a solution that works. Doing what you're doing is not going to make things move any faster. All its going to do is wipe out 6-7 months of everyone's hard work....

 

[DeletedUser13082]

Inno clearly aren't listening to what is needed. It doesn't matter whether ghosting exists or not, the entire GvG concept is a complete farce, it's unfair to the higher ranking guilds. We can lose a sector costing a guild maybe 100 goods roughly, for us to take it back it costs over 1000? How is that fair, obviously we don't stand a chance once we get to higher ranks, so what is the point in fighting to reach the higher ranks?

As for not hitting AA. As of yet we haven't, like I said, once we have enough fighters in the guild the goal will be completely clearing an entire map as quickly as possible to prove how bad it can be if it doesn't get fixed. When that time comes, yes we will hit AA, we will also hit unforgiven, slayers and even my own guild Titans. Nobody is exempt once that time comes, anybody on the map we choose to hit will get hit.

Back to the agreement part (this will be the last I say on it as it's a little off topic). OoB have recently been dropping sectors in order to lower siege costs, where is the difference between that and what we're now doing? There isn't one. I've been against ghosting and other bad tactics since the beginning, I initiated the entire no ghosting agreement which kept E world completely free of those sort of tactics once we had all agreed to it. OoB guilds, excluded Dragons, found different loopholes and such like to get around the agreement we all made, they're still doing it now. But even with that being said, what we're doing now is nothing to do with retaliation. It's (in gate2's words) adapting to what we're given. We're stuck with a terrible game concept which is clearly being ignored despite all the complaints it gets, I'm aiming to change it by proving how bad it can be.

We've got members of multiple different guilds with us in the new guild, OoB members are welcome too if they want to come over. It's not a personal attack against any single guild, it's an attack against terrible game design. Truthfully, I'm quite surprised you haven't given up yet too, I've been the most stubborn about it all up until this point, but now I've given up, we're not going to get the change so I'd rather enjoy myself and at the same time prove a point that the change is needed.

Look at the stir coming up in here again already, just a few days after it's started, the complaints on the forums about our new guild is exactly what I'm aiming for. The more who complain, the less it can be ignored.

Something like THIS, or anything similar is needed. That's all there is to it. that's my personal opinion, but plenty of people share it.

 

[DeletedUser97768]

@DO: OK, so say INNO do decide to change the seige costs. What then? How will they compensate for what has already been spent so far? Its not realistic. I think even if they wanted to change things, its so far gone now that they cant.
At best they can start with new seige costs on a new world. Cant see that happening on already existing ones to be honest.
So what is it that you want? Mass drop out of players who are frustrated because of ghosting? Not that its not happening already for whatever reasons, lol..

But if demolishing all sectors in an Age is your stated aim, then why are you going after other GGs who are going after the Alliance members? They are still basically doing what you're doing and achieving your aims aren't they? Why are you still holding on to some sectors? Why are hawr-nee and his ghost guild taking sectors off OoB so that Autonomous and Unforgiven can cap them? Ultimately you are not doing what you say you are, and using the demo guild as an excuse to further enhance the 'Alliance'. In effect, you are simply ghosting for the benefit of a particular guild or group of guilds - pure and simple. You are contradicting yourself. I will believe you when I see you take sectors off the Alliance. When and if that happens, I might even join you myself lol!

And there IS a difference between releasing sectors to gain goods and ghosting - you pretty much know this yourself. You are releasing your own sectors within your mass of hexes - always a possibility to cap them again if need be, without the fear of someone else capping them.

I totally agree that GvG is totally screwed up and INNO designers have messed up. Believe me, I appreciate what you're saying and I actually support your idea of seige goods. Like I said, I've even put forth this idea myself long ago on the forum. But you think what you're doing is going to stop INNO or make them change their minds right away? I tell you, they are already aware of this - you can be sure of it. But they will do whatever suits them best and makes them the most moolah. That's the bottom line. Why do you think ghosting 'does not contravene current game rules', although it actually does, if you look carefully at the In-game rules? Its just so that big guilds will be tempted to buy diamonds to procure goods to recap a lost sector. That's why. Why would INNO care whether you and I think its unfair, so long as the bucks are still coming in?

Look at the stir coming up in here again already, just a few days after it's started, the complaints on the forums about our new guild is exactly what I'm aiming for. The more who complain, the less it can be ignored.

And what if they just ban you and your guild mates for causing this stir and violating the rules? What does that accomplish then?

Dont get me wrong DO..I'm all for a total revamp of the existing GvG system. And your suggestion is a brilliant solution that will both create equality in the GvG across guilds and get rid of ghosting altogether. But you're not going to accomplish it by doing what you're doing. If and when INNO do realize their error and correct it, well and good. But until then, play fair is all I ask.

 

[DeletedUser13082]

You're more than welcome to join us any time. I'll message you in game now anyway as we're drifting off topic

 

[DeletedUser99445]

All the players who have turned to demo or ghost guilds have been enjoying themselves. Last time I checked on the whole "game concept", this seemed to be an important factor.
Some could argue then that GvG does work in it's current format.
If ghosting and demo guilds and HQ dropping were not available then all map sectors would have been conquered and everyone would be sat around moaning about how dull GvG is and how bored we all are.
As long as we have these so called problems of Ghost/Demo/HQ Delete, we can all rest assured that if we want to fight and have fun, then we can.

 

[DeletedUser97768]

All the players who have turned to demo or ghost guilds have been enjoying themselves. Last time I checked on the whole "game concept", this seemed to be an important factor.
Some could argue then that GvG does work in it's current format.
If ghosting and demo guilds and HQ dropping were not available then all map sectors would have been conquered and everyone would be sat around moaning about how dull GvG is and how bored we all are.
As long as we have these so called problems of Ghost/Demo/HQ Delete, we can all rest assured that if we want to fight and have fun, then we can.

You can do that in PvP too. Ghosting is only fun for those who are doing it, and goes against the spirit of fair play.

 

[DeletedUser99445]

You can do that in PvP too. Ghosting is only fun for those who are doing it, and goes against the spirit of fair play.

No it doesn't go against the spirit of fair play. restricting the way that players play when they quite clearly are NOT breaking any rules goes against the spirit of fair play. That's where you and some others on here fit in.
This GvG hasn't panned out the way you want it to, so you and some others on here are determined to make the game the way you want it to be. Hence the constant Bleating and Moaning and Whinging.

 

[DeletedUser13082]

Guild versus Guild is here! Your guild is fighting for survival and power. Your goal is to expand your guild's territory and hold on to it, to level up your guild and gain bonuses and glory for all its members.

That is the way that GvG was intended to be played. That is the way it was advertised. That was what we expected. Demolition guilds, ghost guilds and all the rest are not in the descriptions we were given. Nowhere did it advertise GvG as:

"Defend against the annoyance of ghost guilds who will take your sectors, wasting your goods while spending none themselves. Watch as your enemies destroy everything you have earned because they can do it cheap without consequence"

I don't recall seeing that part, do you?

 

[DeletedUser99445]

That is the way that GvG was intended to be played. That is the way it was advertised. That was what we expected. Demolition guilds, ghost guilds and all the rest are not in the descriptions we were given. Nowhere did it advertise GvG as:

"Defend against the annoyance of ghost guilds who will take your sectors, wasting your goods while spending none themselves. Watch as your enemies destroy everything you have earned because they can do it cheap without consequence"

I don't recall seeing that part, do you?

No I don't recall seeing that but I don't recall seeing it advertised as the perfect game for death ouron to play either.
Its fun and it works. Admittedly it doesn't work for you but that's not a reason to change it over to suit you.
Go to the lower era maps where ghost and demo guilds don't often operate and the game is as you want it played. NOTHING happens down there. All the sectors are done and no one plays there anymore.
Take away the ghost and demo in the higher era maps and you will have the same result. BOREDOM. A game for the retired to play.

 

[DeletedUser99445]

AND GvG is optional......if you don't like it then don't play it. Pretend it never happened and leave us happy players to play GvG without you Please.

 

[DeletedUser13082]

AND GvG is optional......if you don't like it then don't play it. Pretend it never happened and leave us happy players to play GvG without you Please.

You're not playing GvG though, you're just damaging the people who are playing it.

And I know stagnation comes without ghost/demo guilds, that's why goods costs need changing. It gets rid of ghost/demo guilds and also releases everybody from the stagnations caused due to costs being too high. Two birds, one stone. Simple as that.

I never said it should be perfect for me. The concept of GvG in general, even if goods costs were changed, is still terrible in my opinion. There are a lot of better ideas that could have been used for GvG, but this is what we have. I'm not asking for a perfect feature to suit myself, if I wanted that then GvG would need to be removed entirely. What I'm asking for is a feature that is fair for everybody that plays it. If people want to fight then it shouldn't cost some more than it costs others. That's unfair no matter how you look at it.

 

[DeletedUser99588]

Pretend it never happened and leave us happy players to play GvG without you Please.

Happy players seem to be the minority

I could understand ghost guilds because they had a purpose that would lead to acquiring more sectors for the mother guild. Demolition guilds on the other hand are just PvP point generators. I guess that is a purpose but I think we would all agree not the intended one for GvG. I also understand why they exist but feel for those that have been damaged by them. The real culprits are the developers who have sat on their hands for to long. Although I do not advocate knee jerk reactions or sledgehammer changes the measures that have been taken to date have only made matters worse and the frustrating thing for many is that it was clearly predicted the changes would have a negative effect on the game and yet they plough on regardless.

I do not believe there is a perfect solution because the GvG concept is floored and to simplistic (IMO). All that can be done now is to try and revive some life into it but unfortunately a lot of damage has already been done and many have left the game or lost total interest in GvG.

 

[DeletedUser13082]

Happy players seem to be the minority

I could understand ghost guilds because they had a purpose that would lead to acquiring more sectors for the mother guild. Demolition guilds on the other hand are just PvP point generators. I guess that is a purpose but I think we would all agree not the intended one for GvG. I also understand why they exist but feel for those that have been damaged by them. The real culprits are the developers who have sat on their hands for to long. Although I do not advocate knee jerk reactions or sledgehammer changes the measures that have been taken to date have only made matters worse and the frustrating thing for many is that it was clearly predicted the changes would have a negative effect on the game and yet they plough on regardless.

I do not believe there is a perfect solution because the GvG concept is floored and to simplistic (IMO). All that can be done now is to try and revive some life into it but unfortunately a lot of damage has already been done and many have left the game or lost total interest in GvG.

+1 this

 

[Praeceptor]

+1 this

Although I disagree with your view on this death, I also +1 on this.

GvG is flawed.
PvP was ruined.
Devs ignored advice.

What is happening is inevitable whether you (we) like it or not. My view is to play the game as it is presented (not as it was envisaged) until the Devs get their collective fingers out, and then we'll all find a new way of playing it.