DeletedUser
Great idea! Thumbs up for this one.
-
Dear forum reader,
To actively participate in our forum discussions or to start your own threads, in addition to your game account, you need a forum account. You can REGISTER HERE!
Please ensure a translation into English is provided if your post is not in English and to respect your fellow players when posting.
-
We are looking for you! Always wanted to join our Support or Forum Team? We are looking for enthusiastic moderators!
Take a look at our recruitment page for more information and how you can apply:
Great idea! Thumbs up for this one.
DeletedUser5514
good idea: seller should pay the fp if trade is taken
DeletedUser99588
I think having the 'OPTION' to prepay the fp is a good idea. Would not want to see it changed as a replacement to the current method but only as an addition to what we can do.
DeletedUser2989
My question regarding that option would be does prepaying restrict the trade to being picked up by non-guild members or would the FP be paid back if a guild member picks up the trade or if it expires? I don't think people would be happy if they prepaid only to have a guild member pick it up or to have it time out and lose an FP for nothing. Also just a minor concern of mine would be the potential for people to then abuse the market as a form of "FP bank" by setting up trades no one would take (1 Stone for 1 Papercrete as an example). The FP's would only be stored for a week but you could store a fair few that way (getting them all back by deleting the trades when you need them) and it could be really annoying to others seeing so many bad trades spammed.
I certainly like the intent of the idea and it's be a nice idea to probably help those early on but I can see it being spoiled by misuse.
I certainly like the intent of the idea and it's be a nice idea to probably help those early on but I can see it being spoiled by misuse.
DeletedUser99588
Some good points Tank. First of all I'd not considered the player getting their fp back. Once spent it is gone but maybe the trade shouldn't time-out if you have pre-paid the fp and if you delete the trade then you lose your fp.
If a guild member takes it then they take it. As a player you were desperate for the goods hence pre-paying the fp so be grateful you got them. I imagine most that care about the fp cost will have tried getting the trade accepted in-guild prior to placing a pre-paid trade on the market.
If a guild member takes it then they take it. As a player you were desperate for the goods hence pre-paying the fp so be grateful you got them. I imagine most that care about the fp cost will have tried getting the trade accepted in-guild prior to placing a pre-paid trade on the market.
DeletedUser7719
Another three options that may be a bit more complicated:
One would be instead of having these small, medium, and large packages in your inventory, you have an FP bank. The only other way of adding to the bank other than from packages would be from buying FP with coins. Paying for the FP must come from the FP bank so there will be no abuse associated with it when getting FP back from aborting or having a guild member take it.
The second option would be pretty much what thanatos describe except there is an option to have non-guild trades, so this option would limit a guild member from taking it (if you don't select the option, you just have the potential of losing the FP if a guild member takes the trade).
The third option would limit the amount of paid trades to 10 as each time you make one, 1FP is deducted from your FP bar as well as the maximum FP you can hold (once you have 10 trades up, you cannot make anymore paid trades, but you can still use FP via FP packages. Aborting or having a guild member take the trade would in turn add 1FP to your bar + increase the maximum FP.)
Though I personally I'm not fully in favor of option one and three (as one would require major changes and three would likely not be used that much), the second one would be beneficial and plausible imo.
One would be instead of having these small, medium, and large packages in your inventory, you have an FP bank. The only other way of adding to the bank other than from packages would be from buying FP with coins. Paying for the FP must come from the FP bank so there will be no abuse associated with it when getting FP back from aborting or having a guild member take it.
The second option would be pretty much what thanatos describe except there is an option to have non-guild trades, so this option would limit a guild member from taking it (if you don't select the option, you just have the potential of losing the FP if a guild member takes the trade).
The third option would limit the amount of paid trades to 10 as each time you make one, 1FP is deducted from your FP bar as well as the maximum FP you can hold (once you have 10 trades up, you cannot make anymore paid trades, but you can still use FP via FP packages. Aborting or having a guild member take the trade would in turn add 1FP to your bar + increase the maximum FP.)
Though I personally I'm not fully in favor of option one and three (as one would require major changes and three would likely not be used that much), the second one would be beneficial and plausible imo.
DeletedUser99588
Your second option is already an idea that has been suggested many times but never taken on board by the developers. Having that option would also allow non fair trades to be placed without causing friction within a fair trade guild. However, it doesn't seem to be something that interests the developers as it is a fairly easy change. They would no doubt argue they don't want to make the trading process too complicated as we are all such simple folk.
DeletedUser108240
Let Trade Flow.
Thanatos post #53:
Frankly I am a bit sad that the thread have turned into a discussion about the FP-tax only. I gave that as an example of the problem, not as "THE Solution".
Tankovy post #59:
Of course here in the Early Middle Age I have little need for the resources they do have (and presumably produce), such as ferrocrete or renewable resources.
One thing I would point out here is that I said that in the very first post. The deck is stacked against noobs in this game, at least as far as trading is concerned. Could we conceive that trading problems might be a contributing factor in turning people idle ?
fischh posted:
love Villow
Thanatos post #53:
I quite agree. Trade flow is a lot more than whether or not there is an FP-tax. It is however fairly clear that the FP-tax decrease the nr of trades taken (especially with small trades) That in turn teaches new players that it is futile to post trade offers or look at the market, and that is a wrong lesson to learn in a game where trade is a necessity from before the end of the bronze age.
Frankly I am a bit sad that the thread have turned into a discussion about the FP-tax only. I gave that as an example of the problem, not as "THE Solution".
Tankovy post #59:
Again I agree. Not because ALL players are new, far from it, but because most of the old players we have are effectively gone idle as far as the open market is concerned (I have noticed several such). They have started several Great Buildings and are now marking time waiting for those building to get built, They may still be trading via guild-only offers, who knows
Of course here in the Early Middle Age I have little need for the resources they do have (and presumably produce), such as ferrocrete or renewable resources.One thing I would point out here is that I said that in the very first post. The deck is stacked against noobs in this game, at least as far as trading is concerned. Could we conceive that trading problems might be a contributing factor in turning people idle ?
fischh posted:
I do not see this as a solve to the problem of getting trade flowing at all. Oh I would happily pay the FP just to get a wider base of potential responders, But in early stages of the game it would merely accelerate the problem of the market becoming a place not worth posting trade offers on (or looking at).
love Villow
DeletedUser96867
I would suggest creating a separate fp bank within the market system. You'd place fp in the market bank by pressing a "+" button each time would move one fp from the normal fp bar to the market bank. Once the fp are in the market bank they can not be used for any function other than pre paying the fp fee for trading, other than perhaps paying the fp to accept a trade from another player which hasn't been pre-paid. If a trade expires or is filled by a guild member the fp for that trade is simply returned to the market fp bank.
There is no way to abuse this to bank up fp for bulk use, other than if there is an advantage in having fp banked up for filling trades, but I don't really see how that is of a great concern.
Programming of this should be rather simple but........ well i'll leave it at that.
There is no way to abuse this to bank up fp for bulk use, other than if there is an advantage in having fp banked up for filling trades, but I don't really see how that is of a great concern.
Programming of this should be rather simple but........ well i'll leave it at that.
DeletedUser
That is a perfect solution!
DeletedUser96867
LOL, which is why there is no point even talking about it.
DeletedUser99588
Even in my very first city and I didn't have a clue what I was doing I always managed to get the goods I needed. My first hood started of with about six neighbours and was down to just three at one point where the others hadn't logged in. At the time I didn't realise that wasn't normal. The market consisted of a few trades and the NPC ones. I didn't have a guild or really know what they were at the time. So I messaged the neighbours I had and asked them for trades. Surprise surprise they were happy to help. When I was moved to a larger hood and had started my own guild, still in Iron Age, I would check to see what my neighbours were producing and ask for trades. If I saw a neighbours trade and could help but didn't want to spend the fp I would message them and tell them I'd set a trade up for them. Some took it some didn't. I eventually found chat and monitored it for a while and then started using it for trading. Not just for my own benefit, if I could help others i would and before long you find you have some good trading partners.
Trades flow for those that want them to and I'm not saying there won't be times when certain goods are hard to get but that is market forces. I guess the best advice I can give is to communicate with other players whether they are neighbours, guildmates or on chat. Help others and don't try and be greedy by trying to get unfair trades. By doing this you should be able to get those trades that your guild cannot meet cleared.
Does the fp tax reduce trading?
Yes and no. It doesn't reduce trades that are really required as players will tend to pay the fp if they really need something. It does reduce trades just being cleared because they can and not because they are actually needed.
Is it meant to do that? Yes.
Why?
It is a balancing factor otherwise we would all just be given the boost for everything and goods would not be a major facet of progressing through research.
I saw in Brisgard you were on global and requesting a trade yesterday Villow and you got it. I did whisper and message you offering help. Whenever you ask for help in global always keep an eye on the whisper icons as some players prefer to do it that way.
Trades flow for those that want them to and I'm not saying there won't be times when certain goods are hard to get but that is market forces. I guess the best advice I can give is to communicate with other players whether they are neighbours, guildmates or on chat. Help others and don't try and be greedy by trying to get unfair trades. By doing this you should be able to get those trades that your guild cannot meet cleared.
Does the fp tax reduce trading?
Yes and no. It doesn't reduce trades that are really required as players will tend to pay the fp if they really need something. It does reduce trades just being cleared because they can and not because they are actually needed.
Is it meant to do that? Yes.
Why?
It is a balancing factor otherwise we would all just be given the boost for everything and goods would not be a major facet of progressing through research.
I saw in Brisgard you were on global and requesting a trade yesterday Villow and you got it. I did whisper and message you offering help. Whenever you ask for help in global always keep an eye on the whisper icons as some players prefer to do it that way.
DeletedUser
I agree with no changes to the fp charge for trades outside of a guild.
If your guild isn't working for you, then switch guilds. I know of plenty of active ones where all the players, or a specific few even, make sure trades get cleared. Most guilds are "fair trade" guilds, but I am aware of several who allow any rates for trades. So if you haven't found what you are looking for in a guild, then keep looking. Or if it really isn't available, then start one. If you have that many issues, then others will also and will join the guild.
Most of us have been able to advance without issues regarding this fp 'tax'. I find plunderers to be more of a hindrance to trades than the fp tax is.
-1 on this idea. .. actually -1M if it were possible. As someone else said earlier, there are hurdles intentionally and that is as it should be.
If your guild isn't working for you, then switch guilds. I know of plenty of active ones where all the players, or a specific few even, make sure trades get cleared. Most guilds are "fair trade" guilds, but I am aware of several who allow any rates for trades. So if you haven't found what you are looking for in a guild, then keep looking. Or if it really isn't available, then start one. If you have that many issues, then others will also and will join the guild.
Most of us have been able to advance without issues regarding this fp 'tax'. I find plunderers to be more of a hindrance to trades than the fp tax is.
-1 on this idea. .. actually -1M if it were possible. As someone else said earlier, there are hurdles intentionally and that is as it should be.
DeletedUser108240
Since the last post there have been major changes in the trade flow on my world. It has become MUCH better. Where before it was rare to see more than 10 offers on the open market, now there are hundreds. Before coming to post this I saw fifty pages of different offers in all ages. Amazing.
So now more people are looking at the market when they need something, and that makes it a lot more likely that my offers will get taken, with or without an FP-tax.
I dont know who did it, or how they did it, but trade is actually flowing now. Thank You
love Villow
So now more people are looking at the market when they need something, and that makes it a lot more likely that my offers will get taken, with or without an FP-tax.
I dont know who did it, or how they did it, but trade is actually flowing now. Thank You
love Villow
Last edited by a moderator:
DeletedUser99692
Dear Villow
The amount of trade on the open market that you can see is often dependent on the number of people in your neighborhood the age range of the players in it & the number of friends you have. I have 80 neighbors & 140 friends who provide me with 79-129 pages of trade on average. My tip increase you friends list this will not only give you greater access to available trades but more opportunities for Aid coin & Bps.
The 1 fp tax should stay if nothing else to stop the formation of Farming Sister Guilds mass feeding their GvG Home Guilds the 7 day cooldown stopped players jumping in and out with supplies if they take the tax off open market trades it would be too easy to move goods in bulk.
The amount of trade on the open market that you can see is often dependent on the number of people in your neighborhood the age range of the players in it & the number of friends you have. I have 80 neighbors & 140 friends who provide me with 79-129 pages of trade on average. My tip increase you friends list this will not only give you greater access to available trades but more opportunities for Aid coin & Bps.
The 1 fp tax should stay if nothing else to stop the formation of Farming Sister Guilds mass feeding their GvG Home Guilds the 7 day cooldown stopped players jumping in and out with supplies if they take the tax off open market trades it would be too easy to move goods in bulk.
DeletedUser
I'd just be happy enough it they make Market serverwide as they did in AH in WoW.