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Prevent forge point donations that exceed the limit on a GB

  • Thread starter DeletedUser117610
  • Start date

Should the game prevent forge point donations that exceed the limit on a GB

  • Yes

    Votes: 25 64.1%
  • No

    Votes: 14 35.9%

  • Total voters
    39
Status
Not open for further replies.

DeletedUser117610

Proposal:
If two players make a donation at the same time, where the combined value of those donations exceeds the amount required to level the GB, then the game punishes the player whose donation hits the server second by accepting a donation that is the amount left to level the GB. The proposal is for the game to reject the donation and show a warning instead.

Have you Checked the Ideas section for the same idea posted by someone else? Is this idea similar to one that has been previously suggested?
This was rejected as being a bug in forum.en.forgeofempires.com/index.php?threads/out-of-sync-gb-view-causes-incorrect-amount-of-fps-added-and-gb-levels.39883/. It might not be a bug, but it is very bad design.

Reasons:
  1. There is no likely circumstance in which a player would want the game to alter their fp donation and accept a lesser amount, as in many cases this will cause a significant fp loss. No one would be pleased if the game increased their donation, so why is it ok for the game to reduce the amount if this can cause an ever greater loss?? The game should allow players to make their own decisions rather than making very poor decisions on their behalf.
  2. The GB owner may not want their GB levelled. Whilst they may appreciate the extra fp in some circumstances, in a friend or guild situation it can be very inconvenient as they might be compelled to provide a refund
  3. If you try to donate more forge points to a GB than is shown on screen as being required to level it, then the games shows a message "You cannot contribute more forge points than required for this level" and prevents you from submitting that donation. This is a sensible validation and for consistency should be enforced on the server to avoid the problem described in this proposal.
Details:
The expected behaviour is:
  1. The donation is rejected
  2. The game shows a message "You cannot contribute more forge points than required for this level"
  3. The GB screen refreshes to include all donations
Visual Aids:
-

Balance:
N/A

Abuse Prevention:
N/A

Summary:
The current implementation makes a poor decision on behalf of players when it should be pushing the decision back to the player to make themselves. IMO it is daft, lazy and mean spirited. It may have 'always been this way' but that doesn't make it right or fair - please just fix it already.
 

Agent327

Overlord
The problem is that you think you have the right to the spot you try to claim with your donation. You don't. How is the game supposed to know you do not want to donate the amount you try to donate if you do not get the spot you are after? How is the game supposed to know you do not want a significant loss. You could be donating because you are paying for goods you bought. Players asked for the possibillity to donate this way. They got it. There is no reason to turn it back or change it.

This might not been similar to ideas previously suggested, but it is similar to several remarks made in the feedback thread. Feedback that has been forwarded to the devs. That makes this idea rather moot.
 

Deleted member 118943

It makes sense considering it a bug as long it shows another number on the box whille it has refreshed on the server and remains same
I pretty believe that they dont want to change it - it still works like a bug but if they insist, what can we do ? lol
 

DeletedUser117610

2 people voted against this :?

@Agent327 at least you read the proposal before you slammed it, even if you didn’t comprehend. The difference is intent. Throwing away 1000 fp is a choice you can make, having the game decide to do it for you is different altogether.

Good apps enforce business rules on the client and server. This one has client validation that prevents over payment and server validation that decides to throw away your fp instead. It isn’t sensible at all. The ruling was that this isn’t a bug and I can see a case for that as a technicality because someone has gone out of their way to code this abomination, but that doesn’t mean we have to like or accept it.

The purpose of the Ideas section is to make suggestions to improve the game. Instead of being defeatist “it’s all been said before in some post somewhere so there’s no point” - vote for a better game. What harm in trying? And if that has no chance of succeeding the Ideas section may as well be closed.
 

Agent327

Overlord
@Agent327 at least you read the proposal before you slammed it, even if you didn’t comprehend. The difference is intent. Throwing away 1000 fp is a choice you can make, having the game decide to do it for you is different altogether.
Your intent is to snipe the spot. You gamble and take the risk. Since when are you supposed to get whatever you use to gamble back, just because you lose?

Simple solution. Don't donate.
 

Deleted member 118943

@Agent327 you gave a point ( a strong one ) but still, from coding aspect its a visual bug
@Lord Grok with 3 votes over 100 ? 1.000 ?! 5.000 !?! players ? They ain't gonna review it, they know it is a bug but they have their reasons to keep it as it is and not develop a better one
 

DeletedUser117610

@Agent327 it happens in 90% threads also. Even if you reload a thread where people claim spots, or reload a GB after a delay, sometimes the lag means that the donations don’t show. I don’t accept that there should be a risk like this to sniping either; if you pay the correct amount to lock a spot then that spot is yours.

You and I are probably never going to agree on anything but I do appreciate you making the effort to make a case for your view, ty.
 

Agent327

Overlord
Claim spots, lock a spot, sniping. Neither of those seem to be intentional game parts. Can't find any explanation on the Wiki, which must mean they are player inventions and not Inno intentions. If they are player inventions players should accept the consequenses if it goes wrong. It is not up to Inno to make it fool proof.
 

Deleted member 118943

Claim spots, lock a spot, sniping. Neither of those seem to be intentional game parts. Can't find any explanation on the Wiki, which must mean they are player inventions and not Inno intentions. If they are player inventions players should accept the consequenses if it goes wrong. It is not up to Inno to make it fool proof.
Nah, you are wrong, Inno made the Arc and created the numbers, telling us they made the apple but they didn't knew that players are gonna eat it its another story.

As for the Idea - IF it Does NOT Refresh the amount of FP's it is a bug from coding aspect.
The fact that they have reasons to keep it like this is also another story.
 

Deleted member 118943

You give the devs way to much credit they have no idea how the players are going to use a feature they add to the game
The players find the loopholes the devs never even consider
Nah, its a way to motivate little kids making them feel they inventend something, im pretty sure Inno wasn't lucky on that one.
They made CF and recurring quests aswell :) This might not be in wiki too haha
 

Deleted member 118943

Absolutely true.
If Devs had added Random Numbers then maybe you 2 could convince some people, but its hard to convince people by providing << The Absolutely True >> Proof.
Google is full of Guides - Sites that maybe use Cookies and FoE does not.
Its a multi-way win for Inno, they can't be so lucky :)
I am a very lucky person myself with numbers, but i know what is luck and what is not :D
 

legend9182

Brigadier-General
The thing is that
Any big company like inno sees consequences before releasing anything. So they had knew that. Players could use that in this way. So don't think inno is enough fool release something op.
Cf and arc both had must be thought alot before getting added.
 
Proposal:
If two players make a donation at the same time, where the combined value of those donations exceeds the amount required to level the GB, then the game punishes the player whose donation hits the server second by accepting a donation that is the amount left to level the GB. The proposal is for the game to reject the donation and show a warning instead.

Have you Checked the Ideas section for the same idea posted by someone else? Is this idea similar to one that has been previously suggested?
This was rejected as being a bug in forum.en.forgeofempires.com/index.php?threads/out-of-sync-gb-view-causes-incorrect-amount-of-fps-added-and-gb-levels.39883/. It might not be a bug, but it is very bad design.

Reasons:
  1. There is no likely circumstance in which a player would want the game to alter their fp donation and accept a lesser amount, as in many cases this will cause a significant fp loss. No one would be pleased if the game increased their donation, so why is it ok for the game to reduce the amount if this can cause an ever greater loss?? The game should allow players to make their own decisions rather than making very poor decisions on their behalf.
  2. The GB owner may not want their GB levelled. Whilst they may appreciate the extra fp in some circumstances, in a friend or guild situation it can be very inconvenient as they might be compelled to provide a refund
  3. If you try to donate more forge points to a GB than is shown on screen as being required to level it, then the games shows a message "You cannot contribute more forge points than required for this level" and prevents you from submitting that donation. This is a sensible validation and for consistency should be enforced on the server to avoid the problem described in this proposal.
Details:
The expected behaviour is:
  1. The donation is rejected
  2. The game shows a message "You cannot contribute more forge points than required for this level"
  3. The GB screen refreshes to include all donations
Visual Aids:
-

Balance:
N/A

Abuse Prevention:
N/A

Summary:
The current implementation makes a poor decision on behalf of players when it should be pushing the decision back to the player to make themselves. IMO it is daft, lazy and mean spirited. It may have 'always been this way' but that doesn't make it right or fair - please just fix it already.
Forgive me, if I am misunderstanding this. Are you trying to ask the Game moderators or Developers to have a position of stopping someone from placing FP's into a GB for the purpose of not levelling said GB. Or are you asking them to develop a way to STOP players from Depositing FP into a GB whereby, the GB Levels and there is a loss of FP for perhaps a Guildie or Friend that was depositing those FP's?

To me, the ONUS should always lie on the person that is performing the said act of donating the FP's into any GB to first ensure that it is safe to do so. Believe me, I have many a time gone to donate FP's into a GB (this is mainly due to the medications I am on), only to find that someone else has beaten me to the finish line as such. So much so, that it has been made a ruling that each person choosing to donate FP's into any Guildie's GB is to double check that donations aren't being made before blindly doing so. This is only the humble opinion of a lovable K9.
 

DeletedUser117610

@Scooby Dooby Doo you have misunderstood, I’m not asking for either of those things. If there is 1999 fp remaining to level a GB and 2 players both post 1000 fp at the same time, then the game accepts 1000 fp from one player and 999 from the other. This normally means the player whose donation hits the server milliseconds later misses the slot they were bidding for and instead takes a significant loss.

I’ve lost over 2000fp as a consequence of this in the past 3 days (after I posted here). I’ve been unlucky as it doesn’t normally happen so frequently, but players like myself who are far from the server and thus have higher latency are more likely to suffer from it.

I agree the onus should be on the player which is why I am suggesting that if your full donation can not be placed then the server should show an error message and allow the player to make a sensible decision on how to proceed, rather than accepting an amount other than what you specified. This is consistent with the way the UI is implemented; if you attempt to place more fp than is required to level then you see a notification of this fact and may choose to adjust your donation; my argument is that the server should do the same.
 
Status
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