Inequality in Guild Battlegrounds

[Karoleva]

Hello. i would like to complain about guild matching in GBG. we are small national guild with 20 players. last round we were in platinum with 900lp and took 3rd place on purpose to get +75lp to not get matched with top guilds who have 1000lp every round. guess what happened? this round we are 7 guilds and 5 of them are top strongest GBG guilds with 1000lp and 60-80 members. why 975lp got matched with 1000lp? it's almost impossible for us to break this neverending circle, when in platinum we're 1-3rd and in diamond we're 7-8th. it seems like we're getting matched by global ranking, so probably we will have to release our sectors in GVG in order to get similar opponents in GBG. but that's not how it should work.

 

[Knight of ICE]

why 975lp got matched with 1000lp?

Cause diamond league is the group 901 - 1000 league points

it's almost impossible for us to break this neverending circle, when in platinum we're 1-3rd and in diamond we're 7-8th. it seems like we're getting matched by global ranking, so probably we will have to release our sectors in GVG in order to get similar opponents in GBG. but that's not how it should work.

No, you are matched by league points. If you want similar opponents you need to lose in platinum league.

 

[NoblePaul17]

Taken sometime to read through all posts and noted alot of worthy aggrievances, the main one being about Big guilds dominateing GbG, and have also noted some very good ideas ( and some very strange ideas ) on how to remedy the given situation, now Inno is working on a reduced max % available idea, Not to sure how this will workout and i'm with holding any form of thought on the matter. however through all I have read not a single mention of introduceing a new league, I dont know but you could call it the " Titamium League " this would spread the guilds out further, and also push the big dominateing guilds together, gone would the ability to dominate a map, smaller guilds would be in a greater position rather than locked to there HQ for 14 days, and the ability to swapout sectors reduced as the playing field becomes more level in equality. No need to reduce max % as this has impact on smaller members ability, and map speed.
Anyhow just a thought, others with greater minds will find a way, and hopefully soon.

 

[Kims Hubby]

I wonder if they took an idea out of GVG so the more buildings you build, the more treasury goods it will cost. Big guilds would have to produce/buy goods to dominate and at some point would go broke from overspending in GBG. Just a thought that could add to a solution maybe.

 

[Dianna The Huntress]

I would like to know if FOE intends to change GBG
At the moment in this GBG Battleground, another two big guilds have the monopoly of half the map ( another two have the other half )
We as a smaller guild are stuck in the middle of the two guilds above and have not a hope in hell of getting any fights in "((
They will not even let us out the front door to the first landing that has two x SC for us to be able to fight, they want these they told us as to help them fight
so we were told to fight sideways, right no SC for us!
That entails no SC and when we are able to take a sector sideways there is nothing else to do as these two large guilds have the sectors locked for four hours
If we are here when the four hours are up they make sure they pin us in first so we are not able to move out, they do tend to fight far quicker than we can as they have so many on
This is not the first time this has happened and not only to us either, many guilds are in the same position as we are
Why not place these large guilds together to fight it out and leave the smaller guilds to be placed together to do the same that would be fair
These larger guilds have many players that fight with no attrition and do thousands of fights by the end of just one GBG
How is that fair to the others that want to play but are pinned inside and not let out
Why not make everyone's attrition the same, no SC either just plain old good-fashioned fighting
When your attrition is up your out for the day, let someone else have a go and play
Now these guilds have worked out who will be fighting who and members move around from one guild to another to play as they have many guilds and work together, if you are not in one of these guilds then your not going to get anywhere or any fights
We were told if we wanted to fight, we could join their guild for the next round of GBG
That's not what we want, we want to play a GBG without all this stand-over merchant attitude

 

[Andrew420]

I would like to know if FOE intends to change GBG

https://forum.beta.forgeofempires.com/index.php?threads/guild-battlegrounds-watchtower-and-siege-camp-ability-re-balance.15644/

 

[LouBlueWarrior]

Even though it seems unfair and abusing, I can only think that creating a bigger league is the best for everybody, but in the future. I havent face a situations like that in my server ( Dinegu) and I am sure my guildmates and I are too weak and too ''fresh'' in GBG. I am sure also that many players ,for years now, have found ways to stay on top on every guild competition, and as much as annoying and unfair it is the situation you describe here, its their strategy/way/gamstyle to achieve their goals. Right now ( without knowledge ) I suspect that only few guilds per server have the ability to play like this, I am sure that when many more guild come to that point, a new harder league will be created. Interesting topic and would love to read more from more experienced players than me.

 

[papashakes]

I wonder if the algorithm is what needs tweaking

in our match up this season the guilds hold the following positions in the prestige rankings 2, 8, 11, 12, 27, 29, 35, 36

the top 3 guilds have been battling it out (not farming) and claiming most of the territory.. my guild is in 27th so obviously we're lucky to hold a couple of sectors at a time.. the bottom 2 guilds have barely held 1 sector..

 

[LouBlueWarrior]

I wonder if the algorithm is what needs tweaking

in our match up this season the guilds hold the following positions in the prestige rankings 2, 8, 11, 12, 27, 29, 35, 36

the top 3 guilds have been battling it out (not farming) and claiming most of the territory.. my guild is in 27th so obviously we're lucky to hold a couple of sectors at a time.. the bottom 2 guilds have barely held 1 sector..

I think it seems fair... For the guilds that are ranked among 1-10, the rest are easy to beat. With the same logic, guilds among 11- 30 have better chances than below rank guilds, while they struggle against higher rank. So it seems in every match up there is a ''top-medium-low'' (3 way) system that guilds are selected. It would be much more unfair if the prestige ranking was like 2,3,5,7,9,35,37,39 and gerenerally in a way that would remind a ''top-low'' (dual) system. At least in my server and being about 200 ranking a couple years now, the 3way systems is fair so far

 

[papashakes]

I think it seems fair...

it would from the perspective of a guild with a ranking of 200 and who you get matched with.. the top 3 guilds took every sector on the map in 10 (that's right TEN) minutes of GbG opening burning diamonds as they went and once a sector is open they have it loaded in 2 minutes.. leaving no chance for us lesser guilds..

this may appear balanced from your perspective but believe me it's not..

not that I'm complaining this is the way the game is set up so I just have to accept that and enjoy it when our guild is matched with more compatible guilds at our level..

 

[Overlord Dex]

What is a compatible guild level though?

There are 7 members in my Guild, but only 3 including myself are in a position to commit to the Battle Ground, so who should we be put up against to keep everyone's chances even?

I've seen single players do better than my Guild and we've beaten other Guilds with 15 or 20 members!

I can't see any system getting it 100% right!

 

[Bastious]

I have noticed that almost all the Guild Battlegrounds my Guild has been pitted against are players of 7 and 8 digit long. some are 5 and 6 digits but very few. I am the biggist player at 96Million but the next biggest is at 34Million. I have been consistantly been thrown at 484Million or 1,500Million with the members trickling down from there in Diamond League. Maybe My Guild should not be there but certainly we should not be lumped into a League that is so lopsided to where the strong can never lose.

 

[DevilishRen]

By achieving a mmr high enough to get into diamond league your guild has proved that it is good enough, otherwise you wouldn't be there in the first place.

The number of people in a guild would only be relevant if you could guaranteed that everyone played.

My guild (originally 7 players but now 15 strong) regularly beats guilds of 70-80 players, other times we get smashed up. We currently have a mmr of 1000

Don’t agree, its not because you won against guilds not playing much and then are pushed in diamond that your guild can actually fight the top guilds, thats a big misconception, the league levels algorithms are not programmed properly
how can in 7 guilds have 2 top guilds and 5 lower level guilds fair, they are kept strapped to their HQ. Its not a battlefield its a playground for 2 guilds and being on both sides as I play different worlds it gets boring the 4 hour swap, wash rinse repeat …

 

[DevilishRen]

Raised this before and its disappointing it has not been addressed
Check this round, we are a low level guild, why are we placed against high performing GBG guilds? Within a few hours they have grabbed the whole map then its the 4 hr routine of swapping sectors. All good for them and the players they get lots of free goodies, can use camps properly snd get lots of fights in, however none of the small guilds have a chance at battles and also winning the free stuff, we would all like a chance to win some, we can add camps but in these conditions we can’t even use them so what's the point‍
Why do you not put the top 21 GBG performing guilds in battlefields of 7 in each and then let them really have a go at a real battlefield, they could make deals, alliances and still swap but it would become a challenge instead of a humdrum, next round do a different mix, keep them on their toes, many are getting bored so this would bring their brains awake and get strategy going, then do the same withe the next group top from 22 to 43 and so forth
It would give us all a chance to at least try and create alliances, buy camps and also enjoy GBG, the current league levels are not well synchronized, its not because you managed first against other lower level guilds that you should be pushed to the diamond league and plays against the top world players, maybe have a look at the algorithm and have true real levels compete. It’s frustrating and deceiving they way it now works. Thought you guys were working on changing this so the game is fair for everyone and lower level players we are helping build up can at least have a taste at GBG

 

[Knight of ICE]

Raised this before and its disappointing it has not been addressed

Can not find where you raised this before, but it has been addressed before. Even if you put the top 21 GBG performing Guilds in the same battefields there still will be Guilds that are outperformed and result will be that they complain because of that. If you want better results, join a better Guild.

 

[Basileus Dahlia]

GBG is very frustrating. Platinum league is too easy, usually only two, maybe 3 guilds are active at a time. The other ranks must be miserable if you can AFK to platinum. So you have to actively TRY to lose in Platinum if you even have 3 active fighters. And that means no rewards, so throwing sucks.
So you don't throw. Then you get put up in Diamond. Suddenly your rank 70ish guild is fighting guilds in the top 20 and getting absolutely smashed as you have 3-5 fighters against their 20, and they often have a player or two with more points than your entire guild combined.
What ends up happening to my guild is we bounce between getting no farm because nobody will take anything in platinum, to getting no farm because we can't participate at all with the mega guilds rampaging the map before we can do anything.
And these mega guilds sometimes don't even bother with siege camps, so reducing siege camp effectiveness like what was on the beta is not a solution to this whatsoever and only makes it harder for us.
My solution is just to have another league. Even just one, Put it ahead of diamond. Make it have a small amount of available space so the big top guilds get put in it and they can duke it out, and leave diamond for the guilds who have active players but not people coked up on supersoldier serum.
NOT just go "you're rank 20 because some AFK player with a billion points." But actual ranking, and you can fall out of it and fall into it if you're doing really well.
With a higher rank that would mean more rewards. No big player would complain about that. Why would they? More space on a province and get 13fp instead of 10? Extreme doubt.

 

[Bastious]

I am going to suggest that unless a fair and equitable table set up by the programmers that we can choose to Boycott the BGb until this situation is taken care of.

 

[DevilishRen]

and what would be your solution to this problem ?
those 2 teams get removed from GBG because they outsmart all other

No the solution is to analyze who are the regular top 21 GBG teams, ( they are programers after all right ) then you form a real diamond league out of those teams only, you set up 7 top teams into a battlefield , then they can really setup alliances and do a battlefield, as it will become much more challenging as they will be of much more equal force. Right now its not because you beat the guys in the below level who are medium strength like you that you can beat diamond league top guilds , that train of though is completely erroneous and untrue if and a real analysis of guild performance would easily show this. Then in the league below they could take the next 21 leagues, so 22 to 42 and have these fight against each other. This would create real battlefields where more players could win free stuff, spend to build camps and make GBG much more fun for all
now its either a humdrum of go every 4 hours take over the map, take sectors in a few seconds , blocked guild try to get a few fights in if your lucky, wash and repeat

 

[DevilishRen]

GBG is very frustrating. Platinum league is too easy, usually only two, maybe 3 guilds are active at a time. The other ranks must be miserable if you can AFK to platinum. So you have to actively TRY to lose in Platinum if you even have 3 active fighters. And that means no rewards, so throwing sucks.
So you don't throw. Then you get put up in Diamond. Suddenly your rank 70ish guild is fighting guilds in the top 20 and getting absolutely smashed as you have 3-5 fighters against their 20, and they often have a player or two with more points than your entire guild combined.
What ends up happening to my guild is we bounce between getting no farm because nobody will take anything in platinum, to getting no farm because we can't participate at all with the mega guilds rampaging the map before we can do anything.
And these mega guilds sometimes don't even bother with siege camps, so reducing siege camp effectiveness like what was on the beta is not a solution to this whatsoever and only makes it harder for us.
My solution is just to have another league. Even just one, Put it ahead of diamond. Make it have a small amount of available space so the big top guilds get put in it and they can duke it out, and leave diamond for the guilds who have active players but not people coked up on supersoldier serum.
NOT just go "you're rank 20 because some AFK player with a billion points." But actual ranking, and you can fall out of it and fall into it if you're doing really well.
With a higher rank that would mean more rewards. No big player would complain about that. Why would they? More space on a province and get 13fp instead of 10? Extreme doubt.

The guild rank is actually more about who plays gvg, thats where the big points come from , some guilds even if they are lower ranked in the world may be a top GBG guild

 

[klods hans]

The guild rank is actually more about who plays gvg, thats where the big points come from , some guilds even if they are lower ranked in the world may be a top GBG guild

Exactly. GvG is the biggest guild rank booster. And that's a really good reason to not base GBG leagues on guild rank.
Some guilds go all-in on GvG to compete on guild rank, but they may not participate in GBG at all. And vice versa, some guilds go all-in on GBG but not on GvG, which puts them at a lower rank than the dedicated GVG guilds, but they may be a powerful GBG guild.
So, imagine, if GBG was based on guild rank, how the top ranked GvG guilds end up in Diamond GBG but don't participate because they don't care about GBG. Well, that already happens actually with the current league match system. You can meet top ranked guilds in Diamond who don't do much - and are quite easy to beat - because their main focus is on GvG.